Changes for Round 5: Swans vs GWS

[liz]

I disagree. Although the SCG is relatively short (155m) it is actually relatively wide (136m). It is 2 metres less than MCG (138m) in width but wider than Marvel (129m), Adelaide (126m), and even Optus (130m). GMHBA is a skinny skinny 117m.

What it means is that a zone defence is spread more thinly through the midfield and so going through there is easier by foot than at thinner grounds.

If you’d like to know all the ground dimensions, I got my info from this Foxsports article (which I assume is current enough).

I'm more with The Runner on this question. If the zone defence is trying to cover the entire ground evenly, your observation might hold. But Essendon knew we wanted to go through the corridor and left the wider parts of the wing relatively open. The Swans found themselves going wide more often than in previous games (and did so well enough to create sufficient scoring opportunities to win).

On a longer ground, a team trying to clog the corridor will be stretched out a bit further lengthwise so you would think it's easier to find small gaps without going wide.

At the AGM a couple of years ago, Longmire commented (in response to a question about why our home record was poor, relative to our away record) that the SCG is more challenging to find space on, particularly for young, inexperienced teams. I was a little surprised because I'd always figured the difference in ground sizes has a much lesser effect than often claimed by commentators, by Longmire was very firm in his view that it does make a difference.

[Ludwig]

I dont agree. Rampe is our best full back by a country mile, and is quite happy to take on big forwards. Him and McCartin can take care of most key forward combo's.
Melican would upset the balance to much in my opinion.

Rampe is undersized to play fullback, albeit he does a pretty good job most of the time. The main problem I see in playing Rampe at fullback is that we lose our best flexible defender, the one who knows when to peel off and be third man to the contest or race back to the goal line to save a gave with an adept fingernail touch. Especially now with more one on one play, we need to free up Rampe to help out the others in their own one on one contests.

[Ludwig]

At the AGM a couple of years ago, Longmire commented (in response to a question about why our home record was poor, relative to our away record) that the SCG is more challenging to find space on, particularly for young, inexperienced teams. I was a little surprised because I'd always figured the difference in ground sizes has a much lesser effect than often claimed by commentators, by Longmire was very firm in his view that it does make a difference.

Do you think that should mean that the new Swans should have an advantage at the SCG because our precise kicking can find targets in smaller spaces, while less accurate teams will turn the ball over more attempting these kicks?

Also, we are obviously going to be the more experienced team for playing at the SCG, so knowing the ground is an advantage, as it usually is for the home side.

[Thunder Shaker]

The way to negate Toby Greene is to outscore the opposition as a whole.

We should try to kick straighter. Our first four games we kicked 11, 13, 15 and 17 behinds. This is a numeric sequence we should try to break.

Beat the Giants, and we're off to a good start. South Melbourne / Sydney starting a season with four wins or more is rare, it has only happened eight times. Two more seasons had a draw in that streak for a total of 10.

4 wins before first loss: 1944 (7th).
5 wins before first loss: 2012 (3rd, premiership), 1998 (3rd), 1945 (1st, lost GF), 1909 (1st, premiership).
5 wins and 1 draw before 1st loss: 1913 (2nd).
6 wins before 1st loss: 1986 (2nd).
6 wins and 1 draw before 1st loss: 1914 (2nd, lost GF).
7 wins before 1st loss: never.
8 wins before 1st loss: 1936 (1st, lost GF).
9 wins before 1st loss: never.
10 wins before 1st loss: 1932 (4th).

[AB Swannie]

I'm more with The Runner on this question. If the zone defence is trying to cover the entire ground evenly, your observation might hold. But Essendon knew we wanted to go through the corridor and left the wider parts of the wing relatively open. The Swans found themselves going wide more often than in previous games (and did so well enough to create sufficient scoring opportunities to win).

It depends on what you see as the Swans' new strategy. If you see it as purely go through the corridor then it doesn't matter what ground you are on, teams like Essendon can defend that area. I personally see the change in strategy as more a kick>mark>overlap run method as opposed to the old kick to a contest>bring the ball to ground>win the contested ball. In this way, I think the wider SCG helps us. That is, when kicking from the defensive 50 there is more space to kick>mark>run, be that through the corridor or via the wing

On a longer ground, a team trying to clog the corridor will be stretched out a bit further lengthwise so you would think it's easier to find small gaps without going wide.

I don't think the maths holds up here. For example, if you are kicking from the centre of the defensive 50 arc on the MCG, you still have 111metres to go to goal. In the same situation at the SCG, you have 105 metres to go. Realistically, that extra 6 metres has no impact on the defence of this next kick because players will not be stretched all the way back to the goal line on either occasion. In fact, players are likely to be no more than 80 metres from that kick.

At the AGM a couple of years ago, Longmire commented (in response to a question about why our home record was poor, relative to our away record) that the SCG is more challenging to find space on, particularly for young, inexperienced teams. I was a little surprised because I'd always figured the difference in ground sizes has a much lesser effect than often claimed by commentators, by Longmire was very firm in his view that it does make a difference.

Of course, my above interpretations could be wrong and Longmire just may know a lot more than me.

[rickmat]

Only my opinion watching Melican over the last few years, unless the coaches have stuck a rocket up him, I'm not confident of having him in the current back 6. He tends to go back and not confident to get on with the game to advantage. With the new rule with man on the mark, hopefully he will improve as the Swans have invested in him and as has been said, he got another 3 years. I'm also looking at Gould and Brand as the VFL East Coast Comp starts to see where they are at with their careers.

[ugg]

Well Rampe is out. No wonder they were talking up Melican in the reserves reports.

No Dane Rampe for the Swans in Sydney Derby XX.

He's been playing with a broken finger on his right hand (the one he broke last year) the past two matches. Had surgery this arvo. Could miss up to a month.

— Marc McGowan ??????????????@???????? (@ByMarcMcGowan) April 12, 2021

[dejavoodoo44]

Well Rampe is out. No wonder they were talking up Melican in the reserves reports.

No Dane Rampe for the Swans in Sydney Derby XX.

He's been playing with a broken finger on his right hand (the one he broke last year) the past two matches. Had surgery this arvo. Could miss up to a month.

— Marc McGowan ??????????????@???????? (@ByMarcMcGowan) April 12, 2021

Groan.

[Ludwig]

Fox, Heeney and Rampe all with hand injuries. What's up? Lucky it'\s football and not handball.

Bad to see some of our best players out with injury, but it happen to every team. It will be a good test for our depth. At least they should all be back within a month or so.

[jono2707]

Would've thought Gould would be the closest like for like for Rampe but it seems like he's deemed not yet ready? If so, Melican it is then...

[Ralph Dawg]

I'm a bit worried about our matchups on the 3 big GWS forwards, Himmelberg, Riccardi and Finlayson. Presumably we will be going with McCartin, Melican and Dawson up against these 3. Sounds like George will get first crack at Greene. If GWS get alot of repeat entries, they could do some serious damage. We're going to have to stop them further up field........

[AB Swannie]

Rampe is potentially the hardest player for us to replace. He’s such a unique one on one player who can play equally well against 200cm Joe Daniher and 182cm Toby Greene. With Mills up in the midfield, he also provides amazing leadership. We will definitely be light on in this regard for the next month. Who is our defence leader? I guess Lloyd is now the most experienced but his role has never been to organise. It must be awfully tempting to throw Mills back.

Unfortunately, at this stage Gould is all hype based upon his U18 years. We won’t really know how he is going until the reserves comp starts. I do think we drafted him with Rampe’s role in mind so hopefully we get to see him develop that way this year.

I can’t see Melican not getting picked this week.

[Ralph Dawg]

Rampe is potentially the hardest player for us to replace. He’s such a unique one on one player who can play equally well against 200cm Joe Daniher and 182cm Toby Greene. With Mills up in the midfield, he also provides amazing leadership. We will definitely be light on in this regard for the next month. Who is our defence leader? I guess Lloyd is now the most experienced but his role has never been to organise. It must be awfully tempting to throw Mills back.

Unfortunately, at this stage Gould is all hype based upon his U18 years. We won’t really know how he is going until the reserves comp starts. I do think we drafted him with Rampe’s role in mind so hopefully we get to see him develop that way this year.

I can’t see Melican not getting picked this week.

It would be interesting to know what's going on with Gould. He looks absolutely ripped so clearly he's been getting through his fitness and strength requirements. Certainly at a junior level, he looked to have good disposal and he was able to match it with the men in the SANFL. So I do wonder what's holding up his development? Is he struggling to understand the structures?

[Ludwig]

Rampe is potentially the hardest player for us to replace. He’s such a unique one on one player who can play equally well against 200cm Joe Daniher and 182cm Toby Greene. With Mills up in the midfield, he also provides amazing leadership. We will definitely be light on in this regard for the next month. Who is our defence leader? I guess Lloyd is now the most experienced but his role has never been to organise. It must be awfully tempting to throw Mills back.

Lloyd and Cunningham are both in the leadership group this year, so we should expect that they can handle the organizing in defence.

We've been lucky with injuries until now, so we just have to suck it up and show that we have the depth to cover several of our regulars being out.

[Blood Fever]

Lloyd and Cunningham are both in the leadership group this year, so we should expect that they can handle the organizing in defence.

We've been lucky with injuries until now, so we just have to suck it up and show that we have the depth to cover several of our regulars being out.

Must be tempting to play Mills back on Greene now Rampe is injured, especially if Rowbottom is available. Not ideal given Mills form in midfield but might get job done this game.