ROK - Re signs with swans for 4 years. (Confirmed)

[desredandwhite]

Have we reached the longest thread in the history of RWO yet?

Barrygate - RedAndWhiteOnline.com Messageboard

If you want to talk about Ben Cousins, post it here (mega merged thread) - RedAndWhiteOnline.com Messageboard

RyanGate is still 100 posts behind either of these classics.

That is, if you don't count "Fan Footy" and "Questions and Answers" threads

[DST]

No, actually that's exactly what he's not - tried to play hard ball with Swans in 2006 and was made to look like a total goose when he collapsed at the final moment. The Swans recruiting team will have his measure.

I think your grasp of history is a little hazy.

They played hard ball in 2005 and it cost us back to back premierships. But hindsight is a great thing, I would have settled trading our first pick if meant we went back to back.

In 2006 his position was not the same (Everitt was out of contract) and they were happy to receive a second rounder. He grandstanded by waiting until the end, but it was the deal that was always going to be done. Pelchan knew it and we knew it.

DST

[liz]

I think your grasp of history is a little hazy.

They played hard ball in 2005 and it cost us back to back premierships. But hindsight is a great thing, I would have settled trading our first pick if meant we went back to back.

In 2006 his position was not the same (Everitt was out of contract) and they were happy to receive a second rounder. He grandstanded by waiting until the end, but it was the deal that was always going to be done. Pelchan knew it and we knew it.

DST

Giant is correct that he tried to play hard ball in 2006 too. Held out that pick 32 wasn't sufficient for Spida and reports were that Dunstall told him close to the deadline to pull his head in and do the deal.

If 32 wasn't good enough for Spida (who the Swans could probably have got anyway in the PSD) then 34 and steakknives sure as hell isn't good enough for ROK.

[DST]

Giant is correct that he tried to play hard ball in 2006 too. Held out that pick 32 wasn't sufficient for Spida and reports were that Dunstall told him close to the deadline to pull his head in and do the deal.

If 32 wasn't good enough for Spida (who the Swans could probably have got anyway in the PSD) then 34 and steakknives sure as hell isn't good enough for ROK.

Hardball or just grandstanding, close call.

And you are right Pelchan (hell the whole football world) knows that ROK is worth at least pick 16.

I just find it laughable that posters on these boards think we are going to deal away ROK for a Brad Green swap.

While I have no issue with us trading for Brad Green it won't be for our pick 16, so the deal is unlikely to be done.

DST

[liz]

The reality is, though, that a player of Green's quality probably is worth pick 16. Especially to a club with enough ballwinners and class to use Green's talents. if you look at the value of what a pick 16 is likely to actually deliver - ie on an EV basis rather than factoring in the 1 in 100 chance (or less) that your more likely to get a superstar with that pick than with your pick 30 or 57 or whatever.

[ugg]

Some mooted trades:

Hawks still keen on O'Keefe - realfooty.com.au

The one that baffles me is
Swans: Green
Hawks: O'Keefe
Melbourne: 16 and Simon Taylor

So in essence that would make Green more valuable than O'Keefe? There must be another Melbourne pick coming our way, surely?

Also mentions Corey Jones as another target to replace ROK.

[UglyDuckling]

Some mooted trades:

Hawks still keen on O'Keefe - realfooty.com.au

The one that baffles me is
Swans: Green
Hawks: O'Keefe
Melbourne: 16 and Simon Taylor

So in essence that would make Green more valuable than O'Keefe? There must be another Melbourne pick coming our way, surely?

Also mentions Corey Jones as another target to replace ROK.

I read that too and it seemed absolutely crazy to me that we get Green for O'Keefe and Melbourne get 16 and Taylor for Green.
NO WAY!
I think that we should just get 16 and Boyle for O'Keefe and grow a young team forget Green and use our picks!
But we know bloody Hawthorn will play hardball and try to rip us off.

[Rob-bloods]

Giant is correct that he tried to play hard ball in 2006 too. Held out that pick 32 wasn't sufficient for Spida and reports were that Dunstall told him close to the deadline to pull his head in and do the deal.

If 32 wasn't good enough for Spida (who the Swans could probably have got anyway in the PSD) then 34 and steakknives sure as hell isn't good enough for ROK.

Spida said himself on Melbourne radio in the last few weeks, he believed the 2005 trade could actually have gone ahead except that Hawthorn were preoccupied with other draft matters and the deal simply did not get done in the last frenetic trading hours as the lower priority.

[Legs Akimbo]

I actually think the Swans have tried to develop a long-term negotiating strategy. Slipping into game theory mode, they see it as a repeat game rather than treating each as a one-off. And they have signalled how they want to be viewed by trading fairly for assets they've wanted (and while they've paid decent dollar, I don't think in hindsight we've overpaid for many of the acquired assets given what typical draftees actually do, rather than what fantasies people have about their expectations.)

Not sure that the repeat game scenario plays out well, given changes in personal and 14 other teams to trade with. It has been shown many times that the way to the best possible outcome in such a game is to trade fairly and punish the transgressors if they cheat you by freezing out of future negotiations, NOT being an alround nice guy. We have not frozen out Geelong for Chambers (IMO, we should have sued them ) nor Hawthorn for Spida 2006. We gave St Kilda a super deal last year and in a commercial world, I am not sure they would see any need to reciprocate, especially if Ross Lyon exited the building.

Honestly, I just believe Roos is a very rigid negotiator when it comes to things like player salary and team rules.

On the matter of draft picks, I am not swayed from my opinion that a top 10, even top 20 draft pick today is worth more than it was 5 years ago due to improved accuracy of drafting. When business quietens down a bit, I will run a correlation between draft picks and years paid adjusted for age by year and overall.

P.S. - does anyone know where I can get draft data in a list (presume I can get games played data from Sportswire)

[hammo]

I read that too and it seemed absolutely crazy to me that we get Green for O'Keefe and Melbourne get 16 and Taylor for Green.
NO WAY!
I think that we should just get 16 and Boyle for O'Keefe and grow a young team forget Green and use our picks!
But we know bloody Hawthorn will play hardball and try to rip us off.

Don't worry, Maxfield has clearly stated what we want here:

Swans recruiting manager Stuart Maxfield said negotiations would continue today.

"We rate Ryan in our top five players, so if it is a player-for-player deal it would have to be one of Hawthorn's top players as well. If it wasn't player-for-player we would consider Hawthorn's first-round selection plus a player," he said.

Ryan O'Keefe's salary cut for Hawks | Herald Sun

Meantime, Ryan and his manager are still after more $$$

A trade with Sydney and a deal with O'Keefe, though, was not yet close according to O'Keefe's manager, Tom Petroro, who indicated last night that he wants an improved offer from the Hawks for negotiations to progress.

"Hawthorn has to first satisfy Ryan and then satisfy Sydney. Certainly, Ryan hasn't agreed to anything at this point."

http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/story/0,25197,24467522-2722,00.html

[Wardy]

who's this bloke representing ROK - with a name like that - maybe he has underworld links... Unless of course the wife (who always looks like she sucks on lemons) is pushing for more to enable her to keep living the life she has become accustomed to - I mean she will have to have a new cocktail frock for every social outing she attends and they dont come cheap. A WAGS life is an expensive one.

[goswannie14]

I reckon we should ask for pick 16 and Cyril Rioli! I'd wonder who ROK was then.

[AussieAnge]

who's this bloke representing ROK - with a name like that - maybe he has underworld links... Unless of course the wife (who always looks like she sucks on lemons) is pushing for more to enable her to keep living the life she has become accustomed to - I mean she will have to have a new cocktail frock for every social outing she attends and they dont come cheap. A WAGS life is an expensive one.

Isn't the cost of living cheaper in Melbourne? He should be accepting less for that reason

[Jeffers1984]

ROK in moneybags mode again i see.

[Jeffers1984]

http://www.foxsports.com.au/story/0,8659,24466939-23211,00.html

Article says Green is not keen to leave the city Melbourne but wants to leave the Dees.

Another article in the Telegraph says we may go the route of Pick 16+ player. In the article the Swans have said they don't want a ruckman but the writers suggested we may move for 16 + a forward naming Tim Boyle or Max Bailey (Who is a 208cm ruckman )

Seriously do they do their research?