2021 trading, drafting and list management: players and personnel

[bloodspirit]

It hurts to read that CCJ looked after his former club in trade negotiations, refusing to be brought in via the PSD - AFL news 2021: North Melbourne, Callum Coleman Jones trade, pre-season draft, Tom Lynch, rookie, list plans (foxsports.com.au) - unlike JD.

[liz]

But Dawson isn’t headed for the PSD either…

[Markwebbos]

It hurts to read that CCJ looked after his former club in trade negotiations, refusing to be brought in via the PSD - AFL news 2021: North Melbourne, Callum Coleman Jones trade, pre-season draft, Tom Lynch, rookie, list plans (foxsports.com.au) - unlike JD.

Allegedly Dawson's manager had "robust discussions" with the Crows that walking JD to the PSD was not an option, because JD "wanted Sydney to be compensated for developing him" It doesn't say fairly compensated, but it does say compensated.

He clearly didn't share that information with the Swans at the time or we'd have held firm.

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[Meg]

2021 trading, drafting and list management: players and personnel

But Dawson isn’t headed for the PSD either…

But the threat was implicit ..... which (in the Swans’ view) affected the value the Swans received for Dawson.

That’s the reason Pridham called for a review of the PSD immediately after the Dawson trade was finalised.

https://www.theage.com.au/sport/afl/swans-call-for-pre-season-draft-change-after-dawson-defection-20211014-p58zyv.html

[liz]

Allegedly Dawson's manager had "robust discussions" with the Crows that walking JD to the PSD was not an option, because JD "wanted Sydney to be compensated for developing him" It doesn't say fairly compensated, but it does say compensated.

He clearly didn't share that information with the Swans at the time or we'd have held firm.

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Held firm to what end?

We were compensated, albeit, as you indicate, probably not "fairly". The reality that most trades for out of contract players do not reflect the worth of the player. Unless all clubs commit to some unwritten contract that they will deal "fairly" with other clubs, I don't see that changing.

[Markwebbos]

Held firm to what end?

We were compensated, albeit, as you indicate, probably not "fairly". The reality that most trades for out of contract players do not reflect the worth of the player. Unless all clubs commit to some unwritten contract that they will deal "fairly" with other clubs, I don't see that changing.

Charlie Gardiner says we chose to accept the best deal we could get even though it was significantly below what JD is worth. The reason for that was because the threat of walking him to the PSD worked in the Crows favour. In the end we folded.

Had JD or his manager made it known that Jordan would not allow the Crows to use the PSD, they would have lost their leverage and we could have held firm in demanding a top ten pick.

You could argue JD's decision not to do advise the Swans ensured we did not get compensated fairly for his departure, but also ensured he got to the Crows.

The other possibility is the Crows called JD's bluff.

[Bangalore Swans]

Held firm to what end?

We were compensated, albeit, as you indicate, probably not "fairly". The reality that most trades for out of contract players do not reflect the worth of the player. Unless all clubs commit to some unwritten contract that they will deal "fairly" with other clubs, I don't see that changing.

What’s not to say that the value for Dawson is not fair value. Dawson had an outstanding 2021. He’s yet to put multiple high performing years together.

If he fails to live up to his 2021 form over the next three years then the pick would be fair value.

[Aprilbr]

If JD was a restricted free agent we would have had the chance to match Adelaide's offer or to receive compensation decided by the AFL formula. The latter would have yielded better than what we received in this case given JD's 5 year, high $ contract and his age. There is something not working when we get a worse deal for a player coming into his prime that occurs well before he reached free agency status.

[The Big Cat]

If JD was a restricted free agent we would have had the chance to match Adelaide's offer or to receive compensation decided by the AFL formula. The latter would have yielded better than what we received in this case given JD's 5 year, high $ contract and his age. There is something not working when we get a worse deal for a player coming into his prime that occurs well before he reached free agency status.

I suspect the AFL would have given us an end of round 1 pick which would have been worth less than Melb's first pick in 2022.

[liz]

I suspect the AFL would have given us an end of round 1 pick which would have been worth less than Melb's first pick in 2022.

That's my guess too. That's what the Crows got when Brad Crouch moved to the Saints on a similar level of contract. The absolute best compensation it would have been possible to receive in a free agent scenario is a pick immediately after our first round pick - ie pick 13, which would effectively be pick 15. And that isn't a whole heap better than what we landed up with.

An indication from a departing player that they would prefer not to go to the PSD so that their original club receives some compensation has to have some limits - ie that the original club is not being too unreasonable. Otherwise the Swans could have told the Crows they wanted Tilthorpe and pick 4 or deal off. What would happen then?

I reckon the Swans calculated that Dawson and his management would consider the future first we finally were offered to be a not completely unreasonable trade, and thus their consciences would have been clear had the Swans rejected that and Dawson got to the Crows via the PSD. And when you compare it to what we accepted for, say, Zak Jones, that would be a pretty easy position for Dawson to reach in his mind.

[i'm-uninformed2]

Lord, Doughty has sold that journo a pup. Even Adelaide people know he had two offers on the table for some time, the two-year one to take him to FA, and another the long-term deal. Let alone other crap like the two deals between the two SA clubs being similar. One year of difference, and $100K a year difference. Half a million bucks over life of the contract ain't 'similar'.

What a fabrication. Must be easy in a small town for someone like Doughty to milk the journos dependent on you for drops and inside info to instead get favourable yarns.

Put Matt Turner in the dunderhead category of reporters.

[Auntie.Gerald]

Maaaan........im moving on from yesterdays news re Dawso etc

It is very clear that our club is concerned about the walk away back home factor that the Suns, Bears, GWS and we have to compete with and no doubt these 4 clubs will be illustrating prime examples and trend lines.

So more importantly do we need an extra tall defender to support our charge at the top4 and or a GF in 2022 or do we think between Rampe, Tom, Melican, Blakey, Gould, O'Connor, Foxy and Colin we are good to go and can snuff out a GF style game plan like Melb did first two qtrs...........with Lever, May etc ?

We have Bud and Kennedy still with us and my gut feeling is that 6th to top4 is possible and 2022 is our prime time vs no Bud and no Kennedy in 2023 and or the lesser of the two vs years gone past

[stevoswan]

If JD was a restricted free agent we would have had the chance to match Adelaide's offer or to receive compensation decided by the AFL formula. The latter would have yielded better than what we received in this case given JD's 5 year, high $ contract and his age. There is something not working when we get a worse deal for a player coming into his prime that occurs well before he reached free agency status.

+1

[WomblingFree]

Adelaide are starting to get some form re taking players to the PSD and I fully expect them to extory Gold Coast for one of Lukoscious or Rankine next year if nothing is done.

As has been pointed out before I don't see any point for the PSD going forward and it should be abaloished. Delisted players should be able to be picked up as delisted free agents.

There are two scenarios really I see for resolving issues like this in the future
(1) The provision of a truly independent arbitration body that assigns a fair value that is binding on both parties after a hearing.
(2) That players go through to the National Draft in the instance of a trade not being finalised

[Aprilbr]

Adelaide are starting to get some form re taking players to the PSD and I fully expect them to extory Gold Coast for one of Lukoscious or Rankine next year if nothing is done.

As has been pointed out before I don't see any point for the PSD going forward and it should be abaloished. Delisted players should be able to be picked up as delisted free agents.

There are two scenarios really I see for resolving issues like this in the future
(1) The provision of a truly independent arbitration body that assigns a fair value that is binding on both parties after a hearing.
(2) That players go through to the National Draft in the instance of a trade not being finalised

Great ideas, WF. I would love those two amendments to be implemented.