2021 trading, drafting and list management: players and personnel

[S.S. Bleeder]

If Jordan goes into the draft, wouldn’t the Crows need to use their top pick ( is it 4?) to get him?

So they may as well give it to us in a trade! Wish it was that simple……….

He would go into the pre-season draft, not the main draft itself. The Crows wouldn’t be giving up much, but would also run the risk, albeit unlikely, that he’d be taken prior.

[Steve]

Is there room without the salary cap rules for some creative payments?

For example, are we allowed to bring Max Gawn to the club as a playing ruck coach that we pay him mostly through the football operations budget?

Can Bont come to the club in a dual role as a player and coach of the VFL side. This would allow a good portion of this salary to be paid through the football operations budget saving the salary cap.

Are these sort of playing / coaching deals permitted?

I think it’s safe to say that if an individual is on your playing list, regardless of whatever else you had them do with/around the club, you could only offer them a playing contract and the full amount you pay them comes under the TPP.

Even with third party deals, these days the AFL scrutinise them closely and the compensation has to be commensurate with the actual work done (eg. a player can’t be paid $1M by a club-aligned sponsor to give 1 x 15-min talk to their staff).

Even thinking wildly hypothetically, if they did allow the concept of your Bont example, the pay split would have to be a genuine reflection (ie. if it’s 50/50 they would want to see he’s genuinely splitting his time evenly between playing and coaching, fulfilling the full duties of a VFL coach etc).

Or in your Gawn example, you’d probably have to limit him to playing 6 games a year and do coaching duties for 18 if you were wanting to only pay 25% of his overall earnings from the TPP.

And then separate to all that, the football dept soft cap has been slashed to the point there’s already fewer coaches being overworked - so it’s not as if there’s an unlimited bucket of cash to dip into for that sort of arrangement anyway.

In fact certain clubs are doing the opposite - paying guys to be on their playing list under their TPP but having them do a lot of coaching activities, such is the strain on how much you can pay coaches and other support staff.

[MattW]

Agree with all of that Ludwig. Pick 25 this year plus 28 next year for example equates to pick 9.5 plus also gives us two chances at finding a decent player. I would be happy with that. If Crows weren't we can throw in a later pick or exchange later picks.

The club is going to want to walk away with at least a top 15 pick. It doesn't matter that two seconds equals a first. Reckon they think, justifiably, pick 4 is reasonable. They'd be annoyed, justifiably, that Cerra is acknowledged to be worth pick 6, when Dawson was third in the b&f for a team that came 6th, but there is no suggestion he's worth a single digit pick. Adelaide are chancers - if they want the player, it shouldn't be a deal they're happy with.

[troyjones2525]

Unfortunately anyone who suggests that Adelaide will feel pressure to deal with us because of fear that North Melbourne, Collingwood or Gold Coast pick before them in the pre-season draft are supreme optimists at best!

If somebody could name 1 team in recent memory, if ever, that has drafted a player in the pre-season draft that had nominated another team as their preference during trade week/s then I'll stand corrected! But I suspect nobody can.

I feel/fear there is almost little to no chance we'll get anything remotely of fair value to what Dawson is worth.

Remember, just 12 months ago this same team failed to offer GWS a fair trade and happily allowed Jackson Hately to slide into the pre-season draft to pick him up for nothing! They will have absolutely no fear in doing so again as they know that neither of the 3 teams selecting before them will pick up a player who doesn't want to play for them. Sadly, they have all the power in these so called "negotiations"...

Sent from my SM-G998B using Tapatalk

[Auntie.Gerald]

I don't agree with comments we won't miss Dawso

For me he is a player that allows us to control the ball and attack at an elite kick level.

But the main importance is having a team that is bloody difficult to match up on. The teams that tend to win GFs are hard to break down because they have many weapons / too many to over run.

Dawso keeps our quantity of players that are difficult to beat at a very high level.

[Roadrunner]

I don't agree with comments we won't miss Dawso

For me he is a player that allows us to control the ball and attack at an elite kick level.

But the main importance is having a team that is bloody difficult to match up on. The teams that tend to win GFs are hard to break down because they have many weapons / too many to over run.

Dawso keeps our quantity of players that are difficult to beat at a very high level.

Very true Auntie. There’s only one problem- it seems he no longer wants to play for us!

To win a GF, every player has to be prepared to bleed for the team. I’m not saying that Jordan isn’t capable of that, as the praise heaped on him by Tom Harley shows, but unless he turns 180 degrees, he will be gone and so we will need others to step up. I’m still hoping for a miracle as he has been a major contributor to our team this year though his absence will give opportunities to our youngsters. Whatever we get for him can only be of value down the track so we will be losing out in the short term at the very least.

[i'm-uninformed2]

Were we to get pick 23 from Adelaide then Toby Conway would be a good option.

Solid two year apprenticeship under Hickey and Sinclair and then hoepfully a 10 year player

Our approach to rucks this year will be interesting, given we potentially/apparently have a promising one in Billy King from the Academy crop for next year. Has anyone on here seen much of him?

[waswan]

[QUOTE=troyjones2525;833520]Unfortunately anyone who suggests that Adelaide will feel pressure to deal with us because of fear that North Melbourne, Collingwood or Gold Coast pick before them in the pre-season draft are supreme optimists at best!

If somebody could name 1 team in recent memory, if ever, that has drafted a player in the pre-season draft that had nominated another team as their preference during trade week/s then I'll stand corrected! But I suspect nobody can.

/QUOTE]

Whist this is true in the short historyof pre season picks and outof contract players.

Dawson is quality that wont break the bank, so he cant be outpriced.
Money floating around in general is a lot less likely.
No on is talking about 1M + contracts atm unlike yeara gone by.

North and GC have said they have a preference for established talent.

Sydney are always trailblazers when it comes to player trading ( franklin) adding draft points (rowbottom).
We could very well use another team with ex coach like Blakely or Dew to make this work for us

[Syd76]

Just listened to Tom Harley’s review.

Interesting that TH was very upfront in highlighting the disappointment of losing Jordan. I don’t think that TH, who is very measured at the best of times, has ever been quite as forthcoming about a player. Dawson’s “stature at the club” and contract offer the Swans put to him hints that we will certainly play hardball with any trade.

As someone as pointed our before, the wording by TH was interesting: “Jordan was, and is, still a part of this club”. Maybe that’s posturing, but there is a lot of water to flow under the bridge before this trade gets done. I wouldn’t be surprised if the PSD would be used as threat. I am sure that North would jump at the chance to draft him…..

George on the hand, as we all know is now a Carlton player…

[Blood Fever]

Just listened to Tom Harley’s review.

Interesting that TH was very upfront in highlighting the disappointment of losing Jordan. I don’t think that TH, who is very measured at the best of times, has ever been quite as forthcoming about a player. Dawson’s “stature at the club” and contract offer the Swans put to him hints that we will certainly play hardball with any trade.

As someone as pointed our before, the wording by TH was interesting: “Jordan was, and is, still a part of this club”. Maybe that’s posturing, but there is a lot of water to flow under the bridge before this trade gets done. I wouldn’t be surprised if the PSD would be used as threat. I am sure that North would jump at the chance to draft him…..

George on the hand, as we all know is now a Carlton player…

Saw the video of his review. Agree that he was very steely about Dawson. Club appears to have been blindsided by what has happened. The 'is' word is interesting but probably offers false hope sadly.

[mcs]

Is there room without the salary cap rules for some creative payments?

For example, are we allowed to bring Max Gawn to the club as a playing ruck coach that we pay him mostly through the football operations budget?

Can Bont come to the club in a dual role as a player and coach of the VFL side. This would allow a good portion of this salary to be paid through the football operations budget saving the salary cap.

Are these sort of playing / coaching deals permitted?

I would love to hear from Faunac8, MCS, Ludwig and others who have displayed great knowledge of salary cap issues.

I suspect such creative approaches for top line players, for a club like us (that doesn't have a salary cap sombreror) would be a quick way to the very naughty corner with the AFL.

I think those few deals we are seeing for very much fringe players/players on the edge of retirement is as far as it will ever be let to go. Any further and it'll soon get cracked down on.

[ugg]

Hewett to Carlton confirmed. We get end of second round currently pick 39

[MattW]

Hewett to Carlton confirmed. We get end of second round currently pick 39

Bonus.

[troyjones2525]

Hewett to Carlton confirmed. We get end of second round currently pick 39

Would have loved a 2nd round pick directly after ours but this is probably the compensation that most, including the club, expected us to get.

Farewell George, you may have had your critics at times (including myself here and there) but beyond all that, we'd be hard pressed to find a player who's been more consistent in their performance and has done whatever job the coaches have asked of them than George.

Sad day for the club... [emoji22]

Sent from my SM-G998B using Tapatalk

[Blood Fever]

Would have loved a 2nd round pick directly after ours but this is probably the compensation that most, including the club, expected us to get.

Farewell George, you may have had your critics at times (including myself here and there) but beyond all that, we'd be hard pressed to find a player who's been more consistent in their performance and has done whatever job the coaches have asked of them than George.

Sad day for the club... [emoji22]

Sent from my SM-G998B using Tapatalk

Agree. Busted his backside in every game.