2023 List Management

[Meg]

In 2024?

So this thread should be re-named List Management, 2023?

[BRS328]

Agree with you Wolftone. Ollie is an important resigning this year along with Hayward and Logan McDonald.

[sharp9]

So: We have pick 12 right now (which takes Ben McKay into account) but that will slip a minimum of 2 places (Walter and Read) to a maximum of four places (Croft and anothe GC). Sheesh! I finally managed tonoook at draft prospects and have developed a man-crush on O’Sullivan. (Or is it Sullivan?) Alas my heart will be squashed. #liftsbackofhandtoforeheadandfaints

[wolftone57]

There's an article on the ABC news site called "How the trade period could turn next year's AFL season on its head". The link button that enables one to post links to troublesome websites seems to have gone walkabout (as it does, from time to time) and my attempts to paste the URL as plain text aren't working. But I am sure most people can find their way to the ABC site.

If anyone does, can they explain the charts included in the article? In particular, there is a chart about halfway down the article that purports to show the short term and long term gain or loss in value, using the PAV (Player Approximate Value) as a measure of gains and losses. I get to the second line of this chart and see Richmond. Unless I'm forgetting some major trades that Richmond did, how does a gain of Koschitzke, and the loss of Soldo and Nyuon equate to such a large increase in long term value gained? They got a future second round pick in. Does that really account for all that value gained? Seems bizarre.

And then you look at Melbourne, down towards the bottom, who are shown as suffering a short term loss in PAV. But they lost two players who they weren't playing for most of this year, and didn't seem likely to play much last year. That loss should be offset by the gains of McAdam and, possibly, Billings. You can see the size of the loss attributed to Adelaide from McAdam leaving - some of that bar might be Doedee, except that Brisbane's short term gain is very small (and it's hard to see Fullerton or Gunston offsetting much of their gross gain - Ryan as well as Doedee).

None of it is especially intuitive.

Why do people have to complicate things so much. Footy is NOT Quantum Physics. It is a simple game of see ball, get ball, kick or handball ball (these days just throw will do) & hope ball goes to advantage your team. All these graphs, stats & such don't take into account the human factor of
murphy's Law or The Freak Show (some of Bud's goals etc). As soon as you let the mathematicians, physicists & statisticians loose on your footy field you are in trouble. The complicate things unnecessarily

[wolftone57]

Can anyone offer a good reason why the draft has to be so far away (another 30 days).

How much time do clubs need after the player trade window to finalise their draft strategy and interview the players?

Surely they can walk and chew gum at the same time. It is not as if recruitment teams etc haven’t been watching footage, going to games, monitoring combine results all year etc.

Final Exams. This year they decided not to interrupt their exams. A good idea. It is hard enough to do an exam without having the stress of the draft to cope with

[Maltopia]

Final Exams. This year they decided not to interrupt their exams. A good idea. It is hard enough to do an exam without having the stress of the draft to cope with

Fully support exams not being interrupted.

Maybe the AFL could start and finish later (sacrilege! - it would now be October finals?) so we can have a more contiguous period.

[liz]

Fully support exams not being interrupted.

Maybe the AFL could start and finish later (sacrilege! - it would now be October finals?) so we can have a more contiguous period.

Why do we need a more contiguous period?

The school and underage footy programme runs in a parallel timetable with the men's competition. Shift the AFL backwards and you'll either put the professional and development leagues out of kilter, or you'll push the end of the underage competition right up against exam preparation. And the timing of the season gives a nice window for the AFLW to occupy before it gets too hot (in most years; this year's had "unseasonably" hot days early, which might prove not to be "unseasonable" for long), at least until the length of the AFLW expands.

Regardless of timing, we have approximately six months "on" and six months "off", with the later punctuated by the draft. Does it really matter when that punctuation happens? You still need to find some other hobby to fill up the "off" period.

[Maltopia]

Why do we need a more contiguous period?

The school and underage footy programme runs in a parallel timetable with the men's competition. Shift the AFL backwards and you'll either put the professional and development leagues out of kilter, or you'll push the end of the underage competition right up against exam preparation. And the timing of the season gives a nice window for the AFLW to occupy before it gets too hot (in most years; this year's had "unseasonably" hot days early, which might prove not to be "unseasonable" for long), at least until the length of the AFLW expands.

Regardless of timing, we have approximately six months "on" and six months "off", with the later punctuated by the draft. Does it really matter when that punctuation happens? You still need to find some other hobby to fill up the "off" period.

Some great points there. I think it is crappy though, that the AFL sticks the bulk of the AFLW season on after the men's season. Makes it look even more like an afterthought. I think the AFLW should run inside the men's season. AFLW grand final the night before, and the AFL final the next day.

Despite my lack of understanding of when the junior leagues run, that change to the AFLW dates would certainly avoid the hotter days in October etc.

[liz]

I reckon the thinking behind the AFLW season timing is that it gets more attention in its current spot than it would up against the AFLM. But that’s probably a discussion for our AFLW forum.

[barry]

Barry,
In defence of Kinnear Beatson and his his team I believe we are very fortunate to have such a talented group.
...

I think we have people who know what they are doing.

My view is that our relative success is because we are good at late picks 25+, we have the academies, and we trade well... Maybe because we are a destination club.

We are terrible at first round picks that don't come from academies. We try to be to smart, maybe trying to pick for a position? Just pick the best player available.

[BRS328]

I don’t agree with you on the pick for a position approach, it is part of good list management. A good example is the 2021 draft when we selected Sheldrick instead of VanRooyen. At the time we were facing the coming retirement of Josh Kennedy and Parker was nearing the 30 year mark, so it was the right time to plan for it, and also remember in the draft before this we landed Logan McDonald.
In my opinion all 3 will be good players going forward.

I reiterate what I said previously, I think our recruiting team are as good as anyone in the business, and they demonstrated that again in the recent trade period

[Auntie.Gerald]

If we were based in Melbourne we would be even better

Yes we punch above our weight and we had some serious re- signings and still do next couple of seasons

It is always a mystery when we have launched at two big forwards last few years ie what happens to that $1m per annum?

Would that have meant no Adams and only the other 3 this trade period?

The proof will be in the pudding end of season 2024 Re Gus, Roberts, Konstanty as well as our 4 new recruits in Adams, Grundy, JJ and Kneebone…….then we will all be able to accurately measure the lay of the land re our recruitment last few years

[Thunder Shaker]

Article on the AFL website: How one pick swap helped shape 2023 Trade Period in which Sydney's pick swap with Hawthorn in 2022 had a significant impact on this year's draft.

Not stated in the article, but Sydney's early conclusion of trading this year gave time for these later trades to occur.

[Ruck'n'Roll]

It is always a mystery when we have launched at two big forwards last few years ie what happens to that $1m per annum?
Would that have meant no Adams and only the other 3 this trade period?

That seems extremely likely AG.
The last time we successfully launched million dollar offers at key forwards - we subsequently went an entire decade without being able to recruit any other substantial talent from another club whatsoever.

[stevoswan]

That seems extremely likely AG.
The last time we successfully launched million dollar offers at key forwards - we subsequently went an entire decade without being able to recruit any other substantial talent from another club whatsoever.

The point you make is totally factual abd valid but in the clubs defence, in that decade we made the finals nine times and the GF three times.

Having said that, our current list with key gaps filled by this years canny trading, made possible by freeing up cap space, may take us that one step further to actually winning one of those GF's.