Swans v Giants Elimination Final 2021

[mcs]

I’m quite certain that it’s more and more lame

However, before people jump on spelling, I’d suggest at that auto correct and typos tend to play a significant role in the spelling errors (if my text messages are anything to go by).

As for Toby. The one team I never want to see win a premiership is GW$. But if every team has to win one sometime in their existence, this is the year I now want to see GW$ do it, with Toby watching on from the stands.

But if University never won one, and Freo hasn’t, I’m happy for GW$ to keep them company in the record books. Or better still, GW$ make the Grand Final, lose by a point and Toby will forever know that him missing would likely have been the difference.

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???? NO!!!

09183305 - you ruined the subsequent punch line in my next post But alas - my complete contribution to this thread on this bizarre roundabout has been with tongue firmly in cheek!

On the matter of Greene he got what he deserved. And I do like your scenario you have painted - although I think above that scenario playing out is one in which the Fairypuppies lose by a point after a dodgy free is awarded against them as the siren goes (preferably for a throw that actually was a legal disposal). That is my ultimate dream end to a season where we are not going to be invovled in the final game of the season.

[Go Swannies]

I've barely posted here all year, for a variety of reasons, but I thought I'd re-engage during the run in to finals. I remember a guy who used to post here all the time and ended up getting banned (Matt80 or something like that) but we went on. Petty disagreements are annoying but what saddens me most is fans ripping into our players. Criticism is fine. If a player has a poor game or does something dumb, by all means comment on it, but make it about the action not the player. Ripping into Bell, Melican or anyone else and demanding they be delisted is not cool. They're human beings just like all of us and are trying their hardest.

Roosy always said that you judge a team on its bottom six, not its top six, and the Giants are WAY ahead of of us on that atm. We finished ahead of them because of their injuries. They have most of them back now and their list is outstanding. Yes I'm angry and frustrated that we lost, especially given that I think we were the better team and should have kicked straight in the fourth quarter, but I will make constructive criticisms and list observations, not turn things into a lynch mob.

I always wondered if Matt80 (?) was Footyhead from an earlier generation. Same crap filling the pages, over and bloody over. Do you - or Liz - recall Footyhead?

[barry]

I dislike Toby Greene as much as the next bloke - as long as the next bloke really hates Toby Greene but I thought his game on Saturday was amazing, one of the best individual performances of the year.

The tribunal ruling is perhaps the best this year too. He swore at the umpire (about another player) and then deliberately bumped him. I'd like to think that the same penalty would have been handed down whether it was the sainted Selwood or Barry Hall.

I reckon it would have been 6 weeks in the H&A season.

It probably puts back the timeframe before a player decks an umpire back a few years and that's a good thing, too.

Its a politically correct decision, no doubt about that. The Giants asked for a fine. The AFL asked for 6 weeks. The tribunal took the easy road of meeting half way.
Leaving aside this boards obvious dislike of Toby Greene, and insert random player instead, it asks some serious questions:
1) Why was the AFL asking for a penalty so high?. Like 3 weeks beyond what the tribunal determined was correct. Thats a lot. Its a concern that they are so far apart. This either means that the AFL is anti-player, or that the whole match suspension penalty vs crime is completely out of whack, and no wonder the tribunal is a lottery for all cases this year.
2) Can an umpire really just stand in a players path when walking off the ground, and make the player walk around him. Stevics behavior was odd, and clearly exploiting the position of 'cant touch the umpire'. Surely common sense would have player contact is avoided by both parties?

In all chat groups, here, reddit, twitter, and heaven-forbid bigfooty, the players personality and the team they play for drives emotional responses, which overlook some of the disturbing, lets say amateur, workings of the AFL.

(mcs to save yourself some time, this response has deliberately not been spell checked).

[barry]

And I'll just let through to the keeper your latest language based faux pas.

Your attacks on my english, where english is my second language, have hints of racism. At least thats how it feels from my perspective.

[barry]

I knew an equivalent incident would be found. I cant see any difference between this and Toby Greene.

Martin fined for umpire contact

Actually I can. Martin's was more aggressive. Giants should appeal.

[sprite]

Barry, the AFL would have asked for that penalty as they felt it was warranted and knowing that in a guilty verdict it most likely would not be handed down. In reality they would have been looking for three or four weeks, just like police will seek the maximum penalty in the knowledge that the offender won't be given the full penalty but will still get a decent term of punishment.

I disagree the tribunal has become a lottery, it is the MRO that is the lottery with its classification system.

If you look at the situation Stevic has simply stopped to let the player group get their huddle at 3/4 time. Ask your self how many steps did young Toby take take get to Stevic? He could have taken half a step to the right and still spoke to Stevic and not made contact. It's not exploiting the situation it's commonsense to stop and let the group through.

The only odd behaviour is young Toby's, his behaviour was like one those dills at the pub or in the street who deliberately bump you, in order to prove how tough they are and provoke a fight.

[goswannies]

1) Why was the AFL asking for a penalty so high?. Like 3 weeks beyond what the tribunal determined was correct. Thats a lot. Its a concern that they are so far apart. This either means that the AFL is anti-player, or that the whole match suspension penalty vs crime is completely out of whack, and no wonder the tribunal is a lottery for all cases this year.

If we treat the AFL as a separate entity to the tribunal (which they are, otherwise the AFL would assign the penalty) then the AFL are entirely entitled to want to protect the image of their game. They are also entitled to take into consideration Greene’s ugly track record of misbehaviour. The tribunal will base their punishment in whatever they use to dish out their penalty. The point is, both entities are mutually exclusive.

2) Can an umpire really just stand in a players path when walking off the ground, and make the player walk around him. Stevics behavior was odd, and clearly exploiting the position of 'cant touch the umpire'. Surely common sense would have player contact is avoided by both parties?

In short, yes. Stevic stood perfectly still. Greene was in motion. Greene had the entire oval with which to move his feet. He could have followed any number of his teammates who all managed to avoid physical contact with a completely stationary umpire.

Stevic’s behaviour was completely reasonable and rational. In fact, the only odd thing I see is that Stevic didn’t report, reprimand or berate Greene. Imagine Razor Ray in exactly the same situation.

Common sense would be that Toby Greene (and that might be the only time you see “common sense” and “Toby Greene” used in the same sentence) would realise that:
1) he had been charged on 21 previous occasions and bumping into an umpire would not be amongst the smartest (of the admitting mostly stupid) acts he has committed in his questionable past
2) swearing in conversation with an umpire and questioning his call (which couldn’t be reversed) would achieve nothing
3) he has anger management issues
4) his behaviour is unbecoming of a petulant child, let alone a mature adult and that if any of the actions that he has committed on field was performed in the public (eg bumping into a policeman instead of an umpire, kicking a member of the public, pulling their hair and forcing their face into the ground, spitting at them etc) we would be charged with assault rather than copping a fine or missing a few games. Except that Toby was charged with assault in 2014. He doesn’t seem to have learned a lot in the ensuing 7 years.

You are certainly entitled to defend Greene if you like, but please also accept the rebuttal that you might receive based on the evidence people with the opposing have.

[mcs]

Barry, I suggest you might find a few (well 3 or 4 people perhaps) that agree with you here - https://www.bigfooty.com/forum/forums/gws-giants.318/ . They may actually care as well

As for your personal accusation aimed at me, if you truly consider that to be the case, then report me. I have absolutely zero idea how you reached such a conclusion, but that would give you an opportunity to provide whatever evidence you have to support that accusation to the people that moderate the boards, and they can make a decision. Otherwise, if your not willing to do that, then I suggest it is only reasonable to request you withdraw such an accusation.

[mcs]

Barry, the AFL would have asked for that penalty as they felt it was warranted and knowing that in a guilty verdict it most likely would not be handed down. In reality they would have been looking for three or four weeks, just like police will seek the maximum penalty in the knowledge that the offender won't be given the full penalty but will still get a decent term of punishment.

I disagree the tribunal has become a lottery, it is the MRO that is the lottery with its classification system.

If you look at the situation Stevic has simply stopped to let the player group get their huddle at 3/4 time. Ask your self how many steps did young Toby take take get to Stevic? He could have taken half a step to the right and still spoke to Stevic and not made contact. It's not exploiting the situation it's commonsense to stop and let the group through.

The only odd behaviour is young Toby's, his behaviour was like one those dills at the pub or in the street who deliberately bump you, in order to prove how tough they are and provoke a fight.

I really don't understand in what world there is any responsibility of Stevic to get out of the way of Greene in all of this. I dislike Stevic as much as most other Swans supporters, but I find it quite amusing that anyone would seriously try to mount an argument that somehow he had to take active steps to 'avoid contact'. Otherwise, why is any player fined for accidental umpire contact in play - surely the umpire could just avoid it....

[Sandridge]

Your attacks on my english, where english is my second language, have hints of racism. At least thats how it feels from my perspective.

Yet you were happy to denigrate others for what you perceived to be weaknesses in their knowledge of Mathematics.

[stevoswan]

I knew an equivalent incident would be found. I cant see any difference between this and Toby Greene.

Martin fined for umpire contact

Actually I can. Martin's was more aggressive. Giants should appeal.

The above post is hilarious in it's over reach....having said that, lets read what the voice of reason, Titus O'Rielly thinks:

"The Giants will be hoping their luck holds as Toby Greene heads off to the tribunal for bumping an umpire.

It was 100 per cent on purpose, yet a lot of people seem to have decided defending Toby Greene is the hill they’re going to die on.

That seems strange given the rather extraordinary, sustained effort Greene has put in to prove beyond doubt he is a goose.

Still, in a world where people are taking horse worming medicine, it’s hardly surprising that people have decided to just believe Greene is somehow hard done by."

Are you in the horse medicine camp Barry? That's a serious question....

The Monday Knee Jerk Reaction: Finals Week One - Titus O'Reily | Don’t have faith in yourself

[stevoswan]

Your attacks on my english, where english is my second language, have hints of racism. At least thats how it feels from my perspective.

Pulling 'that' card sounds pretty desperate Barry.....like someone who knows they have nothing left to argue with. As I said earlier, time to move on.

[i'm-uninformed2]

Ol' Gil is apparently thinking about appealing the length of the sentence, arguing it's insufficient.

Personally, I hate Gil, I think Stevic is a ch^^t, and Toby is a dope, so have no dog in this fight - but I reckon 3-4 is about right.

'I find the decision perplexing': AFL considering shock appeal of Toby Greene ban

[Ludwig]

Your attacks on my english, where english is my second language, have hints of racism. At least thats how it feels from my perspective.

Do you mind if I ask what your mother tongue is?

You might consider writing your comments in your native language and use Google translate into English.

If you're a native Yaghan speaker, we should have a chat.

[mcs]

While I don't entirely disagree with what Gil is saying, surely the AFL should be comforted somewhat by the fact that a decent length ban has stuck which has genuine consequences for the player (i.e. he could miss a premiership - at least in theory. The plastics won't get anywhere near it anyway in my opinion, even if he was there). It will surely create enough of a deterrent factor. I think its about right too.