List changes and trade bait

[Melbournehammer]

The events of the past week have the feel of a resignation by our club that we are well and truly in a period of de facto free agency.

• There seemed to be little attempt to retain Membrey. You want to look elsewhere for better opportunities? Fine. Let me show you the door.
• No doubt both Goodes and Shaw have earned a certain right to play on another year or more if they so choose, but you would think a number of younger players would wonder when they will get their opportunity for senior football. I am thinking particularly Biggs and Jones in regards to Shaw. (I had a thought that in the case of Shaw playing on may have something to do with trying to retain Malceski, as I believe they are best mates and this may be a way to get in Mal's ear and convince him to stay).
• Nominating both Davis and Hiscox seems to suggest that we are not all that interested in the national draft as a source of players from around the country, but would rather take our home grown talent, cut out the go home factor, and build a team with academy players and free agents. I know it's draft tampering, but we could have easily taken Hiscox in the rookie draft if he didn't participate in the combine (sore knee excuse). In fairness to Jack, maybe he wanted to get on primary list, even if it wasn't with the Swans, and may have done enough to do so with his combine performance. But recruiters would have or should have known he had those athletic abilities. I think he posted a 3km run in just over 9 minutes previously.
• So many players are finding ways to change clubs, whether in contract or not. If you have a need at a club, you can entice a targeted player to leave his club for yours if you have a good enough incentive. So maybe any worries about lack of depth or ready replacements in the key defender department is irrelevant. If we find ourselves lacking at the end of next year, for instance, we just snare a replacement from another club. This is already happening with ruckmen.
• The draft seems more of an encouragement for the fans of lesser clubs to give them hope for the future, while in reality there is every chance they will lose many of their best performing draft picks to top clubs in future years when they reach their prime. It's hard to work your way off the bottom.
• We are fortunate to find ourselves as a destination club at this point in time. We are likely to have a long period challenging for premierships. A bit of schadenfreude regarding Collingwood; they appear to be in sharp decline and may be looking a long period closer to the bottom than the top. It may even spell the end for their fearless leader.

The way I am seeing the next 2 drafts is that we are getting Heeney this year, Mills and Dunkley next year, and rest will take care of itself.

Things are quiet around the club this trade period, so maybe there will be an unexpected surprise in store. We have a record in this regard.

I must say that I have wondered whether there was a bit of a strategy to look at a free agent next year - assuming that both goodes and shaw retire end of 2015 then there is some $ to throw at something/someone - ie its a bit of a keep your powder dry stategy.

[707]

In an ideal world there won't be any 2nd or 3rd round nominations for Davis and Hiscox and we can pick them up for useless late picks. There is a danger we could lose our third now that Hiscox has blitzed the Draft Combine but hopefully not.

To get Heeney, Hiscox and Davis and still have our late 30s and late 50s ND pick to use would be nice. If Mal goes we'll get another 2nd rounder as a minimum, just need to make sure the Suns have a decent contract on the table.

Comfortable with where we stand at present, still a little worried about getting both Mills and Dunkley next year, Eddie will be working very hard to make sure it doesn't happen.

[Matt80]

The events of the past week have the feel of a resignation by our club that we are well and truly in a period of de facto free agency.

• There seemed to be little attempt to retain Membrey. You want to look elsewhere for better opportunities? Fine. Let me show you the door.
• No doubt both Goodes and Shaw have earned a certain right to play on another year or more if they so choose, but you would think a number of younger players would wonder when they will get their opportunity for senior football. I am thinking particularly Biggs and Jones in regards to Shaw. (I had a thought that in the case of Shaw playing on may have something to do with trying to retain Malceski, as I believe they are best mates and this may be a way to get in Mal's ear and convince him to stay).
• Nominating both Davis and Hiscox seems to suggest that we are not all that interested in the national draft as a source of players from around the country, but would rather take our home grown talent, cut out the go home factor, and build a team with academy players and free agents. I know it's draft tampering, but we could have easily taken Hiscox in the rookie draft if he didn't participate in the combine (sore knee excuse). In fairness to Jack, maybe he wanted to get on primary list, even if it wasn't with the Swans, and may have done enough to do so with his combine performance. But recruiters would have or should have known he had those athletic abilities. I think he posted a 3km run in just over 9 minutes previously.
• So many players are finding ways to change clubs, whether in contract or not. If you have a need at a club, you can entice a targeted player to leave his club for yours if you have a good enough incentive. So maybe any worries about lack of depth or ready replacements in the key defender department is irrelevant. If we find ourselves lacking at the end of next year, for instance, we just snare a replacement from another club. This is already happening with ruckmen.
• The draft seems more of an encouragement for the fans of lesser clubs to give them hope for the future, while in reality there is every chance they will lose many of their best performing draft picks to top clubs in future years when they reach their prime. It's hard to work your way off the bottom.
• We are fortunate to find ourselves as a destination club at this point in time. We are likely to have a long period challenging for premierships. A bit of schadenfreude regarding Collingwood; they appear to be in sharp decline and may be looking a long period closer to the bottom than the top. It may even spell the end for their fearless leader.

The way I am seeing the next 2 drafts is that we are getting Heeney this year, Mills and Dunkley next year, and rest will take care of itself.

Things are quiet around the club this trade period, so maybe there will be an unexpected surprise in store. We have a record in this regard.

If you believe that a period of resignation is upon us, then a big move needs to be made.

I think you know what I'm about to say, but it could shake the place up and have the 2017-2018 team in magnificent shape.

[Ludwig]

It's interesting that Hawthorn will not offer Brad Sewell a new contract. No one would doubt he is every bit of a legend at Hawthorn as Goodes and Shaw are with us.They have an aging midfield without much star quality coming through the ranks. Their great next hope, Mitch Hallahan, couldn't play well enough to crack the lineup depleted through injury after 3 years in the reserves, although Langford did emerge as a real talent. Yet we seem willing to retain aging players who can't kick straight or have leaden legs that can't provide our required 2 way running game and let emerging talent walk out the door.

I am sure the Swans' braintrust are a lot smarter than I am an know what they are doing. I just wish I knew their little secret.

[Ludwig]

If you believe that a period of resignation is upon us, then a big move needs to be made.

I think you know what I'm about to say, but it could shake the place up and have the 2017-2018 team in magnificent shape.

A big move may be coming, but I would be surprised if it's this year. I think we will wait for the dust to settle and will be looking more to the post-2015 season for another big signing. Maybe it will be one of the key talls from Essendon, after they have done their drug penance.

I any case, you just can't jump ahead 3 years and forget the next 2 when players like Franklin, Tippett, JPK, KJ and Hanners are in their prime. We had one monumental disastrous game, but we are every bit as strong to challenge for the premiership in the next 2 years with our current list.

[liz]

It's interesting that Hawthorn will not offer Brad Sewell a new contract. No one would doubt he is every bit of a legend at Hawthorn as Goodes and Shaw are with us.They have an aging midfield without much star quality coming through the ranks. Their great next hope, Mitch Hallahan, couldn't play well enough to crack the lineup depleted through injury after 3 years in the reserves, although Langford did emerge as a real talent. Yet we seem willing to retain aging players who can't kick straight or have leaden legs that can't provide our required 2 way running game and let emerging talent walk out the door.

I am sure the Swans' braintrust are a lot smarter than I am an know what they are doing. I just wish I knew their little secret.

With respect, I think much of this is way off the mark.

Comparisons of Sewell with Goodes and Shaw are tenuous at best. Sewell has been a great player for the Hawks but he hardly compares to Goodes in "legend" status. I suggest he's more the equivalent of ROK, a player Longmire chose not to play for most of 2014, favouring instead greater responsibility for Parker and opportunities for Lloyd and Cunningham. If we were hanging onto ROK for another year and letting Mitchell walk, your point might be more valid. But that's hardly what's happening here.

On the other hand, I am sure Swans fans are well aware of how the Hawks allowed a promising young Kennedy to move on for greater opportunities five seasons ago. It was a call they got wrong, but it's probably the exception that proves the rule. Unless players leave due to homesickness, it is fairly rare for clubs to lose fringe players they really rate just due to "lack of opportunity". Even players who were carving it up at the lower levels. I recall having similar conversations on RWO - a mixture of teeth gnashing and nonplussedness - when the club allowed the likes of Veszpremi and Johnston to leave, after failing to convert decent reserves form to consistent senior performance. If they were super keen on Membrey, I doubt they'd be letting him go as easily as they seem to be. And certainly not just to allow an older player to play on for one more year. Membrey may become a decent AFL player but he's far from a sure thing, and his collection of attributes (ie his size, modest pace and lack of top notch endurance) aren't overly fashionable at AFL at the moment.

As for Shaw, I expect he's been told he might find himself playing NEAFL next season if others overtake him. If that does eventuate, it is hard to imagine a better mentor for the youngsters. Watch any reserves game over the past two years where Shaw has been sidelined with injury and you will see (and hear) him pacing the boundary, encouraging players as they come through the interchange, and screaming out instructions to those on field who can hear him. On the other hand, we are probably less than 50/50 to retain Malceski for next year. Losing both at the same time would leave a big hole in our defence, and a whole lot of reliance on the Jones and Biggs of this world, who have barely 10 games between them.

[Jewels]

With respect, I think much of this is way off the mark.

Comparisons of Sewell with Goodes and Shaw are tenuous at best. Sewell has been a great player for the Hawks but he hardly compares to Goodes in "legend" status. I suggest he's more the equivalent of ROK, a player Longmire chose not to play for most of 2014, favouring instead greater responsibility for Parker and opportunities for Lloyd and Cunningham. If we were hanging onto ROK for another year and letting Mitchell walk, your point might be more valid. But that's hardly what's happening here.

On the other hand, I am sure Swans fans are well aware of how the Hawks allowed a promising young Kennedy to move on for greater opportunities five seasons ago. It was a call they got wrong, but it's probably the exception that proves the rule. Unless players leave due to homesickness, it is fairly rare for clubs to lose fringe players they really rate just due to "lack of opportunity". Even players who were carving it up at the lower levels. I recall having similar conversations on RWO - a mixture of teeth gnashing and nonplussedness - when the club allowed the likes of Veszpremi and Johnston to leave, after failing to convert decent reserves form to consistent senior performance. If they were super keen on Membrey, I doubt they'd be letting him go as easily as they seem to be. And certainly not just to allow an older player to play on for one more year. Membrey may become a decent AFL player but he's far from a sure thing, and his collection of attributes (ie his size, modest pace and lack of top notch endurance) aren't overly fashionable at AFL at the moment.

As for Shaw, I expect he's been told he might find himself playing NEAFL next season if others overtake him. If that does eventuate, it is hard to imagine a better mentor for the youngsters. Watch any reserves game over the past two years where Shaw has been sidelined with injury and you will see (and hear) him pacing the boundary, encouraging players as they come through the interchange, and screaming out instructions to those on field who can hear him. On the other hand, we are probably less than 50/50 to retain Malceski for next year. Losing both at the same time would leave a big hole in our defence, and a whole lot of reliance on the Jones and Biggs of this world, who have barely 10 games between them.

Ahhhh Liz, the voice of reason.

[Meg]

As for Shaw, I expect he's been told he might find himself playing NEAFL next season if others overtake him. If that does eventuate, it is hard to imagine a better mentor for the youngsters. Watch any reserves game over the past two years where Shaw has been sidelined with injury and you will see (and hear) him pacing the boundary, encouraging players as they come through the interchange, and screaming out instructions to those on field who can hear.

Liz I had exactly the same thoughts about Shaw and the possibility that he might have decided to play on accepting that he may spend a lot of time in the reserves. He might not view that as necessarily a bad thing if it eventuates, firstly because he clearly loves and is good at mentoring younger players. And secondly he might see that as an opening into a coaching career, as It seems is about to happen for ROK.

[Bloodthirsty]

Ryder would be nice. Would any of you guys be attending Eddie's funeral?

[Meg]

List changes and trade bait (merged thread)

Re Membrey, surely there would have been no better person to advise on his potential as a top senior player than Crouch. So I assume the judgement was made that he wasn't going to make it as a big contributor (as I too cannot believe the club would have let him go so readily just to allow two older players to play one more year).

In that respect I've been thinking about Trent Dennis-Lane. Kept kicking bags of 10 goals in the reserves but could never quite make it in the seniors. (Although we will love him for ever for THAT tackle in the finals match against Carlton.) I noted with some sadness that St Kilda has delisted TDL. I would have been pleased to see him make it elsewhere but it was not to be.

[Matt80]

Liz I had exactly the same thoughts about Shaw and the possibility that he might have decided to play on accepting that he may spend a lot of time in the reserves. He might not view that as necessarily a bad thing if it eventuates, firstly because he clearly loves and is good at mentoring younger players. And secondly he might see that as an opening into a coaching career, as It seems is about to happen for ROK.

We may have to pass on a reasonable draft pick (late 2nd round) or a deserved rookie upgrade. You may have to delist Dan Robinson if Naismith takes the 3rd year rookie spot. This is the cost of Shaw!

[liz]

'A nobody' every club wants: Heeney likely to be a Swan despite academy controversy - AFL.com.au

A fluff piece about Heeney.

[Matt80]

'A nobody' every club wants: Heeney likely to be a Swan despite academy controversy - AFL.com.au

A fluff piece about Heeney.

Full credit to St Kilda for taking the time to interview him. Heeney will always respect them for taking the time.

Heeney I felt could have also spent some time rotating off half back as well as midfield in 2015 due to toughness and great ball use. Shaw's signing will make that idea more difficult.

[Doctor]

I was surprised to hear Longmire include Membrey in his list of players who'd be moving on in his speech last night. Seems a fair indication that the trade will be happening no matter what.

[Ludwig]

With respect, I think much of this is way off the mark.

Comparisons of Sewell with Goodes and Shaw are tenuous at best. Sewell has been a great player for the Hawks but he hardly compares to Goodes in "legend" status.

I wasn't being critical of our decision to retain Goodes and Shaw. I was only pointing out differences in list management strategy between us and clubs like Hawthorn and Geelong. (I do agree that Goodes is in a special class and not in the Sewell category). The comments about Goodes' and Shaw's deficiencies have come largely from the RWO community. I have rarely, if ever, made negative comments about them in this regard.

In another post I pointed out that I suspected that the Membrey decision was made without regard to Goodes playing on and it seemed apparent that we had chosen Towers ahead of him for the next forward spot. I read that Goodes is having stem cell therapy and other treatment for his knee, and it wouldn't surprise me if he returned next year to win a third Brownlow. I also speculated that letting Shaw play on may be a loyalty statement for the benefit of Malceski; we will have to see about that one. I would be thrilled to have Shaw on our list in an ROK type role next year.

The club has been reticent about its 2015 plans (except to improve), so I have had a number of posts speculating about strategies going forward. I am wondering how we will approach this particular draft, which is one that seems to have a good number of quality KPPs, and in particular key defenders, something we are a bit light on atm.

I have the highest regard for the club management and trust they will come up with the right solution. For the supporters, it's just finding a way to manage this period of deafening silence. Some are suffering from PTSD. Maybe I'm one of them.