2023 List Management

[KSAS]

We also lost Tom Mitchell due to our cap squeeze at the time but got Ollie Florent with Hawthorn's pick. Ollie has developed nicely and think he'll benefit over Tom in the long run, even though Tom would've been valuable in the short team after what transpired later with Hannerbery.

[Maltopia]

We also lost Tom Mitchell due to our cap squeeze at the time but got Ollie Florent with Hawthorn's pick. Ollie has developed nicely and think he'll benefit over Tom in the long run, even though Tom would've been valuable in the short team after what transpired later with Hannerbery.

I’m not convinced that Florent was a good pick at 11. We have so many medium slightish defender/winger/midfielders. We also picked up Matt Ling the next year who is a similar build.

We could have taken any of the following instead of Florent who were in the next eight picks who are all taller players doing well and would fill a need in our team more than Florent does. And if we didn’t have Florent, we would probably still have Hewitt.

-Jarrod Berry (192cm can play forward and back)
-Sam Powell-Pepper (187cm, a tank who can pinch hit in the forward ruck, and finished 5th in club champion award last year and only a few points from third)
-Todd Marshall (198cm, averaged 2.1 goals last year)
-Tim English (205cm, leading ruckman this year)

I like Florent, but it he is a prime example of us drafting medium midfielders year on year with our first pick except for Logan McDonald and the years we had to match bids for Heeney and Blakey.

[Dow]

I’m not convinced that Florent was a good pick at 11. We have so many medium slightish defender/winger/midfielders. We also picked up Matt Ling the next year who is a similar build.

We could have taken any of the following instead of Florent who were in the next eight picks who are all taller players doing well and would fill a need in our team more than Florent does. And if we didn’t have Florent, we would probably still have Hewitt.

-Jarrod Berry (192cm can play forward and back)
-Sam Powell-Pepper (187cm, a tank who can pinch hit in the forward ruck, and finished 5th in club champion award last year and only a few points from third)
-Todd Marshall (198cm, averaged 2.1 goals last year)
-Tim English (205cm, leading ruckman this year)

I like Florent, but it he is a prime example of us drafting medium midfielders year on year with our first pick except for Logan McDonald and the years we had to match bids for Heeney and Blakey.

Couldn’t agree more

[Blood Fever]

Couldn’t agree more

But would you have agreed during the week leading up to the Grand Final, when we were the envy of 16 other teams?

[Roadrunner]

But would you have agreed during the week leading up to the Grand Final, when we were the envy of 16 other teams?

Olle has been great for us last couple of seasons but we should have gone for TimEnglish- hindsight is such a terrific guide!

But in general, we have neglected talls in the draft- Logan is the only one that comes to mind. In the meantime we traded Allir for Hickey and lost Cameron. I think the forward planning leaves a fair bit to be desired! KPP’s take time to develop so you need an appropriate pipeline.

It doesn’t look like we have one, and this is a big worry!

[The Big Cat]

You can't just cherry pick to try and prove other teams get it right more times than we do in recruitment. There were over 40 picks before we chose Chad. We picked Aliir really late after every other team had overlooked him. Tom McCartin was picked in the 30's. Papley was a rookie pick.

[Roadrunner]

You can't just cherry pick to try and prove other teams get it right more times than we do in recruitment. There were over 40 picks before we chose Chad. We picked Aliir really late after every other team had overlooked him. Tom McCartin was picked in the 30's. Papley was a rookie pick.

Of course, Big Cat.
What I’ m saying, as do others, is that we tended to go for mids rather than talls far too often. Our list is unbalanced at present- look at our ressies and name a tall who is ready to come in.

[Ruck'n'Roll]

Olle has been great for us last couple of seasons but we should have gone for TimEnglish- hindsight is such a terrific guide!

Hindsight can be a terrific guide, but if this case I think you should have your macular (or memory) checked.

In 2016 when English was drafted by the Dogs, the Swans ruck roster was headed by DirtyKurt (29 years old back then) supported by Sinkers (then 27) - with a couple of young up and coming rucks by the name of Naismith and Nankervis waiting to take over. We actually did pick up another ruck in that draft, Darcy Cameron.
The resulting ruck congestion led to us shedding ruckman.
I can't see how the drafting of Tim would help. ESPECIALLY as his lame performances in his first few years would very likely have seen us offload him to relieve the ruck congetion and/or salary cap strain anyway.

[Roadrunner]

Hindsight can be a terrific guide, but if this case I think you should have your macular (or memory) checked.

In 2016 when English was drafted by the Dogs, the Swans ruck roster was headed by DirtyKurt (29 years old back then) supported by Sinkers (then 27) - with a couple of young up and coming rucks by the name of Naismith and Nankervis waiting to take over. We actually did pick up another ruck in that draft, Darcy Cameron.
The resulting ruck congestion led to us shedding ruckman.
I can't see how the drafting of Tim would help. ESPECIALLY as his lame performances in his first few years would very likely have seen us offload him to relieve the ruck congetion and/or salary cap strain anyway.

I disagree R&R. Tippett could and did play forward as a KPF, as could Sinkers. I remember a game against the Saints where he dominated up front. Naismith was already injury prone and the ruck position is where most injuries occur, so you need ample cover. Both Nankervis and Cameron should have been given more opportunities while others were “managed”.

And don’t forget that ruckmen need a few years to develop and this was exactly the case with English. The idea is to spot the talent and the potential. Our drafting has been lopsided the last few years by concentrating on mids only.

[Blood Fever]

Hindsight can be a terrific guide, but if this case I think you should have your macular (or memory) checked.

In 2016 when English was drafted by the Dogs, the Swans ruck roster was headed by DirtyKurt (29 years old back then) supported by Sinkers (then 27) - with a couple of young up and coming rucks by the name of Naismith and Nankervis waiting to take over. We actually did pick up another ruck in that draft, Darcy Cameron.
The resulting ruck congestion led to us shedding ruckman.
I can't see how the drafting of Tim would help. ESPECIALLY as his lame performances in his first few years would very likely have seen us offload him to relieve the ruck congetion and/or salary cap strain anyway.

In 2016, Naismith was the number one ruckman with Tippett helping out but mainly playing forward (see 2016 GF team). Nankervis was next in line and would probably have been kept if Naismith had done his knee in 2016, not later. Sinkers was a fair way down the pecking order at that stage. Naismith was very good in almost every game he played but we all know what happened after that. Agree English would have been far from our thoughts.

[Ruck'n'Roll]

Yes Blood Fever, Sam was our #1 ruck in the granny. However overall in 2016 our #1 ruckman was DirtyKurt, he averaged 25 taps per game over 17 games - not really helping out type figures.
Sam only played 12 games, and had a lower hitout average.
And as for Sinkers played 16 games, so his place on the pecking order was definitely not affecting his place in the 22.

Roadrunner, you made some inaccurate statements about 2016. I simply corrected them, that's it.
I've no idea what you're disagreeing with me about. The facts?
In any case, your most recent post seems to be a refutation of an opinion I never expressed, nor fwiw is it one I hold.

My nickname isn't Half-Back-Flanker&Roll - which means I'm happy to discuss ruckman/ruckwork all day long.

[Maltopia]

I was not saying we should have drafted English in 2016. I was merely pointing out the taller players within 8 picks of Florent that we didn't take that would be really helping us right now, as we never take a tall with our first pick except for Logan McDonald and when we had to match a Blekey bid.

-In 2017 when we took Ling, there was Oscar Allen still on the table, and much later, Noah Bolta and Sam Taylor.
-In 2019 we didn't bid on Tom Green, but I am glad we didn't take Fraser McAsey. Some say we should have taken Caleb Serong, but I am only looking at talls.
-In 2021 we took Sheldrick over Jacob Van Rooyen and Josh Goater.

We have certainly been exceptional with our 2nd round picks with Gulden, Warner, McCartin and Parker. Also great with our rookie picks with Lloyd, Rampe and Papley.

It is just the lack of taking talls with our first pick, or trading up further to grab a tall player with Franklin and Reid getting on in age.

Apart from our lack of drafting talls, the way we don't give tall players games means we lose a Membrey, a Cameron and a Nank, and certainly fears that we might lose Gould when we don't even know if he is capable or not yet.

There is picking your best 22, but you also need to develop players and give them a taste of senior football and it also helps with injury management. E.g., if Kurt was rested a few more games, would we have given Nank enough games to want to stay with us? Same with Cameron, if he had played Naismith a few less games to rotate the roster and keep players fit/fresh etc, would have have also sought a trade?

So now, we have Gould we don't know is ready or not and he is still being the sub when we are in depth troubles. He should have been given a couple of games last year so we could develop him and he would be able to come in not as a sub now.

[Nico]

I think where we have failed is not picking up tall defenders. I feel we are only now struggling in the ruck ranks. Tom McCartin was recruited as a forward and Paddy was simply a lucky pick up. While I am not an academic on recruiting like some of us, it appears our recruiting balance has been a bit lopsided. One tall defender a year would have been handy, even if as a rookie.

[Blood Fever]

Yes Blood Fever, Sam was our #1 ruck in the granny. However overall in 2016 our #1 ruckman was DirtyKurt, he averaged 25 taps per game over 17 games - not really helping out type figures.
Sam only played 12 games, and had a lower hitout average.
And as for Sinkers played 16 games, so his place on the pecking order was definitely not affecting his place in the 22.

Roadrunner, you made some inaccurate statements about 2016. I simply corrected them, that's it.
I've no idea what you're disagreeing with me about. The facts?
In any case, your most recent post seems to be a refutation of an opinion I never expressed, nor fwiw is it one I hold.

My nickname isn't Half-Back-Flanker&Roll - which means I'm happy to discuss ruckman/ruckwork all day long.

Fair call. I think Nankervis overtook Sinkers by the end of the year. Pretty sure he played a final that year

[707]

Hindsight recruiting always picks the right players.

I have been a little perplexed about our lack of interest in KP players the past two drafts. Sheldrick was taken the pick before Van Rooyen who is showing a fair bit in his first games for Melbourne.