Team Changes

[ugg]

Vogels did spend quite a bit of time on the ground, more than I expected. From my viewpoint it seemed Bazza was at FF with Vogels at CHF.

[NMWBloods]

Originally posted by barry
Exactly. The realisation that LRT plays an effective brand of football has that effect on most people.
You now have the ability to look past the circus act, and see the endevour. Congrats.

Your reasoning is akin to a circus act...

[Tooth Fairy]

I can juggle

[Mark]

Originally posted by NMWBloods
You're kidding.

To half time, Lucas had 7 possessions, 3 goals. On his way to a match winning performance.

After half time, when LRT went off him, 2 possessions, 1 goal.

As has been pointed out, this is simply not true, and an example where statistics just do not reflect reality.

LRT was not "on Lucas" up to half time as players were being rotated. Kennelly (indirectly) responsible for one of those goals, Goodes another.

I agree LRT has not been great thus far, but at least keep it realistic if you think he plays poorly/wont make it !

[NMWBloods]

He was on Lucas for a lot of the time. Even if you take out the stats and simply watch the game, anyone should be able to see that LRT is not anywhere near the level of any of the other players.

If LRT was good at CHB, we wouldn't need to rotate him off a forward. Barry remained on Lloyd all game.

[stellation]

Originally posted by Mark

LRT was not "on Lucas" up to half time as players were being rotated. Kennelly (indirectly) responsible for one of those goals, Goodes another.

For the goal that appeared to be Goodes' fault (mark by Lucas), Goodes looked upfield and was unimpressed and screaming at LRT (which I was not impressed by), Kirk came over to speak to LRT (which I was impressed by) and a runner came on the ground to speak to LRT. LRT had his head down and went to Lucas after the goal. I don't know if LRT was perhaps supposed to be on Lucas in the first place and tried to run off him (the ball had just been turned over by the Swans) or if he had turned the ball over himself (I think it may have been the former and that Goodes was dropping back in defence and found himself one-on-one at the last minute).

I thought that LRT tried his guts out last night and some of his one-on-one defensive work was good to very good, however his positional play for a key defender was poor.

[Newbie]

I think LRT is progressing. He starts to know how to spoil effectively which he did not do well earlier in the season. He has not yet known how to use the body in contest (Lucas first goal was a clear example). Once he knows how to use the body, he would be a good negator.

For Lucas contribution, he got 3 goals and one assist while LRT was on him. The assist which resulted in Essendon first goal was out in the wing. LRT lost that contest purely due to body-to-body strength. Out of three goals, as pointed out by Mark, two of them were not due to LRT. The one near the square is due to LRT inexperience (or football smarts), Malcom Blight said it pretty well. He should bodycheck the man instead of going for the ball in this case.

One particular interesting fact is the Lucas has no presence when LRT was on him. I notice they ignore Lucas as a go to man in most cases. This was mainly due to LRT was wearing him too tightly and thus Lucas is not an effective option to kick the ball too.

LRT is building up confidence too. At times, he was willing to leave his man and go for the ball which is a good sign.

Btw, Laycock got two goals and three assists while Schauble was on him. Certainly Laycock did contribute to their cause more than Lucas.

[Mark]

Originally posted by NMWBloods
He was on Lucas for a lot of the time. Even if you take out the stats and simply watch the game, anyone should be able to see that LRT is not anywhere near the level of any of the other players.

Agree with most of that, but you cant use Lucas half time stats to lambast LRT on this occassion as he only "partially" played on him.

Agree he also looks way off an AFL player at the moment, seems to take an eternity to make decisions and in all facets of his game.

[NMWBloods]

Originally posted by Newbie
One particular interesting fact is the Lucas has no presence when LRT was on him. I notice they ignore Lucas as a go to man in most cases. This was mainly due to LRT was wearing him too tightly and thus Lucas is not an effective option to kick the ball too.

I doubt very much if they chose to ignore Lucas because LRT was on him. I would suggest it's because Essendon are too Lloyd conscious and their forward delivery is rather haphazard these days.

Btw, Laycock got two goals and three assists while Schauble was on him. Certainly Laycock did contribute to their cause more than Lucas.

Yep - I thought Laycock looked good... and what was that thought I saw here about big young guys taking ages to develop...

[NMWBloods]

Originally posted by Mark
Agree with most of that, but you cant use Lucas half time stats to lambast LRT on this occassion as he only "partially" played on him.

Not completely, but in the same respect I thought it was even more of a stretch from a few different ways that Barry suggested LRT did well on Lucas based on his full game stats.

Agree he also looks way off an AFL player at the moment, seems to take an eternity to make decisions and in all facets of his game.

Agreed.

[barry]

Originally posted by Newbie
I think LRT is progressing. He starts to know how to spoil effectively which he did not do well earlier in the season. He has not yet known how to use the body in contest (Lucas first goal was a clear example). Once he knows how to use the body, he would be a good negator.

For Lucas contribution, he got 3 goals and one assist while LRT was on him. The assist which resulted in Essendon first goal was out in the wing. LRT lost that contest purely due to body-to-body strength. Out of three goals, as pointed out by Mark, two of them were not due to LRT. The one near the square is due to LRT inexperience (or football smarts), Malcom Blight said it pretty well. He should bodycheck the man instead of going for the ball in this case.

One particular interesting fact is the Lucas has no presence when LRT was on him. I notice they ignore Lucas as a go to man in most cases. This was mainly due to LRT was wearing him too tightly and thus Lucas is not an effective option to kick the ball too.

LRT is building up confidence too. At times, he was willing to leave his man and go for the ball which is a good sign.

Btw, Laycock got two goals and three assists while Schauble was on him. Certainly Laycock did contribute to their cause more than Lucas.

Wise words. Lesser viewers see a couple of clangers when there we few options anyway, and call for LRT's head.

Having just watched the replay ( I was at the game), I'm even more impressed with LRT's game. Does a lot of work at ground level for a big man.

I like where he's heading.

[ROK Lobster]

Originally posted by barry

I like where he's heading.

I like Canberra too.

[Ruck'n'Roll]

I haven't had internet over the weekend so I didn't get to respond earlier but the ruckmans here now.

I listened to Sanecrow's comments last week and I decided to pay particular attention to LRT this week (just in case he realy is 'sane' not a total fruitloop). This is every play LRT was involved in and how I rated the balance of the competition between he and Lucas).

1st Quarter
LRT effects a good spoil on Lucas. (Sanecrow says spoils don?t count only marks do (biut I think there worth half a point, so LRT 0.5/Lucas0)
LRT edged under the ball by Lucas, in doing so Lucas also edges himself under the ball. (Still 0.5/0 but the umpires are dills)

LRT loses contact with Lucas who marks a high ball in the pocket and goals. (0.5/6 to Lucas)

LRT effects a good spoil on Lucas (Still 1/6)

2nd Quarter
LRT loses contact with Lucas who gains possession. (1/7)

LRT beats Lucas to ball and sends grubber towards boundary. (1/7 No points for boundaries)

LRT gains possession and feeds off handball to Spriggs on the loose. (2/7)

Match ups change as the Don's fiddle with forward line and Saddo goes on the ball, Goodes takes Lucas, loses touch and Lucas outmarks him.

Match ups reversed, LRT beats Lucas and handpasses to CBolt on the run. (3/7)

Lucas gets ball LRT disposses him and shovels out to Matthews (4/7)

LRT leaves Lucas collects possession at half-back and runs up the wing (burns off Laycock) he reaches half-forward (5/7) and miskicks (Sanecrow cheers 6/7) the ball ricochet?s off a bomber towards LRT who fails to regather (5/7), so he bumps the bomber who gained possession who loses possession (4/7), LRT then tackles the recipient, disposseses him (5/7) and handballs off to Monty (6/7) who passes to Matthews, who duffs the kick at goal. Hard to score this event, such a bizarre mix of goofs and guts.

LRT runs off Lucas again, Keneally?s handball is intercepted, the balls kicked to Lucas in the Goal square who goals with LRT 30 metres away (6/13 not LRT?s fault but life?s tough) LRT drops his head.

LRT spoils Rioli on the boundary (6/13)

3rd Quarter
LRT spoils Lucas (7/13)

Lucas gets tap from ruckman, LRT tackles him, rips the ball out of his grasp (rugby second-rower maul training showing) goes through Rioli and handballs to Matthews who was Rioli?s opponent and is now in the clear. (8/13 and this sort of tough stuff is what I like to see from our big guys)

LRT is penalized for dragging the ball back in, I thought the tackle too high and in the back. (8/14)

LRT smothers a Peverill kick (9/14)

LRT off presumably for his free kick stupidity (although he got a lot of massage in to his calf).

That was his night pretty much.

He had 2 goals kicked against him by Lucas, 1 was a gift thanks to an intercept. He's still too loose on Lucas but what people who weren't at the game failed to notice (and probably what some who were) was the amount of body work LRT put into Lucas off the ball, it was very heartening to see (also probably slowed him dawn for the second half).

However LRT's still too loose and Lucas beat him, but there's no way LRT "Got towelled up by Lucas tonight" sorry Mr.Ugg you're wrong.

And as for Sanecrow's wanting to "question the "red hot go" you reckon he's been having." I hope he would concede that LRT's 5 effort mixture of good and bad in the second quarter was proof at the least of effort (although he may ignore the fact that it was ultimately successfull).

NMWBloods is also incorrect when he refers to Lucas' "match winning performance" not least because Essendon lost (he has trouble with hyperbole). He also goes on about possesion counts to halftime, neatly removing LRT's best effort out of the equasion.

Incidentally did NMWBloods even notice that by reminding all that Lucas averages 15 possesions a game, and that he was already halfway there by halftime you are inadvertently stating that LRT was keeping him to an "avarage" game? Probably not.

Lastly
I thought Tiger had his best game in weeks, and I suspect it was becuse he wasn't having to deal with a key position monster. Because LRT was.
And for those who suggest LRT's taking too long to develop, I suggest remember he's 21, Vogels age and Campbell is 23. If the latter in particular is worth drafting at that age then LRT is definitely worth sticking with.

[cruiser]

Originally posted by ROK Lobster
I like Canberra too.

Siriusly?

[Sanecow]

You should read before you post - and this despite the fact that LRT once again failed to achieve the modest benchmark of a single mark and with as many hit outs as Jude Bolton.

How did you rate LRT's last quarter?