2023 List Management

[Jimitron5000]

I think Grundy would give us a real boost and put us right there among the contenders.
McKay, I'm not so sure about. Our backline is usually effective, especially when we have a functional midfield that doesn't allow easy and direct clearances.

[Ruck'n'Roll]

Grundy was a two time All Australian ruckman, I like a ruckman that can provide a vigurous contet and act as a fourth midfielder - but can he get back to that?
McKay is the monster key defender some of us have been pleading for for years, and can intercept - despite not being all that quick around the padock.

The only worry is how much of a chunk of our salary can will end up absorbed by these two. The cygnets are going to want paying as they amture - and I'd hate to go back to being so strapped for cash that we lose players again.

[Roadrunner]

Gundy was a two time All Australian ruckman, I like a ruckman that can provide a vigurous contet and act as a fourth midfielder - but can he get back to that?
McKay is the monster key defender some of us have been pleading for for years, and can intercept - despite not being all that quick around the padock.

The only worry is how much of a chunk of our salary can will end up absorbed by these two. The cygnets are going to want paying as they amture - and I'd hate to go back to being so strapped for cash that we lose players again.

Grundy would be my first choice now that big Tom is retiring, if we can strike a reasonable deal. He clearly is a class above anyone else available and needs to be No. 1 to be back to his best. Mensa is a No 2 at this stage though he should improve if he can stay fit and avoid brain fades. Stretch has a way to go- maybe a game or two but could be ready in 2025.

[Thunder Shaker]

The current system is designed to favour poorly performing clubs who get free agents poached from them.
So North losing McKay gets better compensation than say, Collingwood losing Moore.

If a free agency compensation pick is after the current pick in the first three rounds, the bottom clubs are clearly favoured. This is right.

If it's a pick at the end of a round, bottom clubs are not favoured at all. IMO the FA system is not pulling its weight here for bottom clubs. For top clubs, the reverse situation happens - an end of round pick is worth too much.

As I showed for North (a club at the bottom of the ladder), there is very little difference between an end-of-round pick and a pick after the club's pick in the next round. The only differences are the order of these picks, and other end-of-round picks in that location, if any.

If FA is reviewed, I hope this anomaly is corrected.

[rickmat]

I'm not one for the recruitment of McKay from North. He doesn't dominate in any of the games even though he plays in an important defensive role. We don't need another ordinary Backman. I'd rather go into the draft and recruit one of the identified top defensive key position possibles. And there are a few in the top 20 to look at

[liz]

I'm not one for the recruitment of McKay from North. He doesn't dominate in any of the games even though he plays in an important defensive role. We don't need another ordinary Backman. I'd rather go into the draft and recruit one of the identified top defensive key position possibles. And there are a few in the top 20 to look at

That's pretty much my thoughts too. I'd be happy for the club to invest heavily in a top-line defender if one were available but it doesn't seem that there is. If we think we need more "mediocre cover", keep Melican (if he's happy to stay) and find another tall body from another club, or even from state league level. Arnold started to show glimpses of potential in the last month of the VFL season. Edwards, too, might turn into something OK in another year or two.

The issue with getting McKay and paying him $800k pa so we don't have to spend any draft capital is not just the difference between that $800k and what he's actually worth as a player. It's also the knock-on effect on the rest of the playing list and salary cap structure. I consider McCartin to already be a more accomplished key defender than McKay, albeit he isn't really physically equipped to play on the new breed of 200cm key forwards. (I'm not sure McKay is either - he has the height but does he have the athleticism to play on a King?) McCartin still has plenty of upside and may develop to the level of the top tier key defenders. But if he just remains around the level he currently is, I doubt he'll command a salary close to $800k relative to the current cap size). But if he knows a "lesser defender" in McKay is getting $800k, I imagine he will be less satisfied with $650k, or whatever his worth would be. And then what do McLean and Amartey expect? The rest of the list who are key to our being a successful team?

[Thunder Shaker]

I'm not one for the recruitment of McKay from North. He doesn't dominate in any of the games even though he plays in an important defensive role. We don't need another ordinary Backman. I'd rather go into the draft and recruit one of the identified top defensive key position possibles. And there are a few in the top 20 to look at

A list (numbers are rankings from Cal Twomey's Phantom Form Guide: Top draft prospects' August ranking):
6 Daniel Curtin Key defender/forward 195cm/94kg
10 Connor O'Sullivan Key defender/forward 198cm/92kg
13 Ollie Murphy Key defender 200cm/85kg
15 Will McCabe Key defender/forward 197cm/81kg - Hawthorn father/son prospect

I expect Curtin will be drafted well before we get our first pick. McCabe will be going to Hawthorn.

So that leaves O'Sullivan or Murphy. Does anyone have some views on these two?

[waswan]

Denver Grainger Barrass was the best defender of his class, not even sure he plays there anymore

Happy to bring Mackay in just not for huge money, if north match walk away and let them deal with Essendon

[Maltopia]

A list (numbers are rankings from Cal Twomey's Phantom Form Guide: Top draft prospects' August ranking):
6 Daniel Curtin Key defender/forward 195cm/94kg
10 Connor O'Sullivan Key defender/forward 198cm/92kg
13 Ollie Murphy Key defender 200cm/85kg
15 Will McCabe Key defender/forward 197cm/81kg - Hawthorn father/son prospect

I expect Curtin will be drafted well before we get our first pick. McCabe will be going to Hawthorn.

So that leaves O'Sullivan or Murphy. Does anyone have some views on these two?

West Coast will take Curtin. There is speculation that North if they get 1 and 2 will take Curtin with 3 (after forcing Suns to match pick 2 on one of their players).

I have suggested we read up to pick 6-8 to grab Sullivan.

[liz]

I suspect our friends down the M4 may have their eye on O’Sullivan simply because he’s a NSW lad and thus has a low go-home risk. They already have a strong and young key defensive group but I dare say they’d like more depth. Unless we trade up right to the pointy end of the draft they will certainly have one pick before ours (Richmond’s first rounder) and they might have two.

[Auntie.Gerald]

Do we think a young 18yr old key defender will help our window opportunity for 2024?

[liz]

In terms of holding down a key defensive post, probably not. But Alex Johnson debuted just a few weeks into his first year on the list, and was established in the best 22 by his second season in a 3rd defender-type role.

in terms of establishing a window of opportunity that lasts far beyond 2024 and as someone to complement our existing brigade of exciting, young, developing players, adding a young tall would be highly valuable.

O'Sullivan is taller than our existing group, in line with the trend towards young footballers getting taller by the year. From what I saw of him during the U18 championships, I suspect he'll adapt quickly to AFL level footy so long as his body holds up. He's not a rake, but nor is he physically developed to the point where you might wonder whether that explains his performance relative to his peers.

[troyjones2525]

Do we think a young 18yr old key defender will help our window opportunity for 2024?

Exactly Auntie. I have always been one to want us to go to the draft as I really get excited at that time of the year forecasting future stars, however now that we have moved out of range of a player like O'Sullivan and the other top 10 talent I'm not as hyped about our draft this year.

With our sensational year last year and now our (hopefully) strong finish and playing finals again this year from where we were 8 weeks ago, I feel that trading well instead of drafting is the key for us now.

If we get say McKay and Grundy and not lose anyone we want to keep (McLean), then barring another disastrous year with injuries, 2024 should be a year we seriously challenge for a flag. Drafting a couple of talented kids won't help anywhere near as much as those two will to our premiership chances in the next 3 years, and it's looking like our time is now, so I say go for it in the trade period!

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[Nico]

Disagree. Time and time again clubs have overrated their lists and have gone the trade rather than draft. You need a balance of youth and experience. We picked up Francis last year. Has he gone any part in bolstering our backline. Most on here think not. JL has always said we have to keep regenerating this list year in year out. So do we go after a big fish and squander cap space? Finally the Franklin factor is out of the equation. I don't want us to give away our number one draft pick for someone who MIGHT fill a gap. McKay has a decent injury history.

We regenerated this list quickly with youth. If you want to produce more speed and run then don't recruit players in the latter part of their careers. The game gets quicker by the year.

I say stick with the draft and don't needlessly give away draft picks.

[Maltopia]

I suspect our friends down the M4 may have their eye on O’Sullivan simply because he’s a NSW lad and thus has a low go-home risk. They already have a strong and young key defensive group but I dare say they’d like more depth. Unless we trade up right to the pointy end of the draft they will certainly have one pick before ours (Richmond’s first rounder) and they might have two.

GWS are currently pick 6 before father-son and Academy matching bids, so we would need to trade in pick 5 (Gold Coast) to be relatively safe.