Tippett!!

[Matimbo]

I'd like to add a couple of my own random thoughts ... based on nothing more than my 6th hand information from the sports press, reading this forum, and my own wisdom of Solomon (I'm often compared to Solomon, but mostly just to highlight the obvious differences)

1. In a criminal case (i.e. the real world), ignorance of the law is not a defence. If you are believed to be mentally capable of being responsible for your actions, you can be judged on them regardless of whether you knew it was against the law ... not suggesting what he did is criminal but even so, I'd think the AFL would place an expectation that each player know the rules relating to their contract. Surely this is stressed to all players? So I can't see the defence of "he was only a 22 year old kid" being accepted. On the other hand, I'd guess KTs legal team should be able to argue for minimising the size of the penalty by claiming the rules are too complex and he was under pressure from the AFC and his manager.

2. This has blown up in a way that must be bewildering for KT and there are reports that he is "growing more and more distraught". This now makes me think if he does get to the Swans eventually, he will be driven by equal parts of: a) relief that he still gets to play footy and b) desire to prove his critics wrong. So I'm thinking the big wake-up call for him could translate into a real win for the Swans.

[Ludwig]

Except for a few top line players, the clubs really have the upper hand in negotiations, just like in other real life situations. Clubs can sack you, delist you, trade you, not play you, etc. In the business world, everyone is replaceable.

I cannot imagine that the AFC is going to point the finger at Tippett personally. It just looks so bad from every perspective, and just not believable. How would it look to other players at the club if their employer turns on them and tries to lay the blame for what professional corporate executives did on a 22 y.o. kid? Would you want to play for that kind of organisation? And it's an embarrassment to the execs themselves.

Unless there is some clear independent evidence that Tippett was part of the negotiations where the rule breaking stuff was discussed, I can't see how anyone is going to say that he was a party to any of this. Obviously, it's not going to be coming from his own camp, and very doubtful it will be coming from the AFC as well. So I think the AFL will only find him negligent in this case, and that he should have been more diligent in questioning his advisers.

The AFC will also keep in mind that it is in their best interests if Tippett gets off lightly, otherwise they are likely to be facing legal action, for which their case is very weak. The courts are not the AFL commission.

Tippett only had one year to go on his contract before nirvana; going back home to the GC on a big contract. The AFC did everything they could to keep their future star, but went over the top on the stupidity factor. I obviously don't know what actually transpired, but can easily see how Tippett could have been totally unaware that any rules were broken. The details of the off contract arrangements could easily have been hidden from him.

[WolfGang]

I think that the Tippett / AFC issue is greater than the Melbourne 'tanking' issue.

If the AFL is silly enough to give first round draft picks if you only win 4 or less games in a season - then any issues that arise are of their own making.
If you have won only 2 games by say round 16 - then I would expect that my team would 'play the kids' say 4 or 5 games each & schedule any regular players who require surgery to have their ops early "to enable them to have a full pre-season".

If I was a Melbourne supporter - I would be really really pissed off if my team was able to use this carrot - and did'nt.

Everyone knows what they and other teams have done - used the system - its just the AFL just do not want to acknowledge it.

[royboy42]

Sorry, but at 22 you've been an adult for 4 years.
You may be naive at times, but not stupid.
Regardless of what he says, he was in this at the time - off the record or not.
Can the AFL prove this though?

But he hasn't said ANYTHING!!

[barry]

I think that the Tippett / AFC issue is greater than the Melbourne 'tanking' issue.

If the AFL is silly enough to give first round draft picks if you only win 4 or less games in a season - then any issues that arise are of their own making.
If you have won only 2 games by say round 16 - then I would expect that my team would 'play the kids' say 4 or 5 games each & schedule any regular players who require surgery to have their ops early "to enable them to have a full pre-season".

If I was a Melbourne supporter - I would be really really pissed off if my team was able to use this carrot - and did'nt.

Everyone knows what they and other teams have done - used the system - its just the AFL just do not want to acknowledge it.

Dont buy this at all. if you think losing games to get draft picks is alright, is it also alright to lose games to get financial reward ? lets say and arm-distance melbounre supporter "in the know" put $500,000 on the tigers, then coincidentally gave $1m to the demons a year or two later...

throwing games hits at the integrity of the game. It changes the ladder position of other teams.
Imagine melbourne get done for tanking. Does that mean all the betting agencies need to refund bets for the demons for that season. As a punter, wouldnt you be in your rights to sue the TAB, the AFL, the demons ? It would be a legal mess.

The only people hurt by tippets deals are really the gold coast who missed out on him 3 years ago.

[AnnieH]

So, do you reckon that if Adelaide had cheated their way to a granny win, Trippet would have stayed at Adelaide?

[barry]

i dont know what Tippetts motives are for leaving Adelaide... If he'd stayed there is probably as much chance of winning a flag there as there are with Sydney. Adelaide have a handy side.

Only reason Ive heard is that he likes surfing.

[satchmopugdog]

i dont know what Tippetts motives are for leaving Adelaide... If he'd stayed there is probably as much chance of winning a flag there as there are with Sydney. Adelaide have a handy side.

Only reason Ive heard is that he likes surfing.

He did say early on ...before he stopped saying anything as RB42 has correctly pointed out......he watched the Grand Final and really liked the idea of playing with the Swans....I have forgotten his exact words but it was to do with us never giving up. I think that is the last official thing he said...the rest has been rumour and innuendo.

[Woodie]

Doesn't the player/manager lodge 3rd party deals with the AFL, not the club? If so he would know about it, if not lodged he would know about it aswell.

[Woodie]

Dont buy this at all. if you think losing games to get draft picks is alright, is it also alright to lose games to get financial reward ? lets say and arm-distance melbounre supporter "in the know" put $500,000 on the tigers, then coincidentally gave $1m to the demons a year or two later...

throwing games hits at the integrity of the game. It changes the ladder position of other teams.
Imagine melbourne get done for tanking. Does that mean all the betting agencies need to refund bets for the demons for that season. As a punter, wouldnt you be in your rights to sue the TAB, the AFL, the demons ? It would be a legal mess.

The only people hurt by tippets deals are really the gold coast who missed out on him 3 years ago.

Barry, I see you point & agree with the integrity of the game stuff, couldn't care less about the betting side. Also agree with Wolfgang, it's quite reasonable that a team down the bottom of the ladder to give kids some game time, try players in different positions & sending them off for surgery etc, it's just planning for the next season. Thats not tanking.

[annew]

I still believe that you can be pressured into signing something you don't agree with if it is the workplace, as I am over 45 and I have just done exactly that because if I hadn't I would have been perceived as a trouble maker. While what i signed was not on the same level I know but still think it possible that at 22 you feel pressured to go along with something that your employer says is ok especially if your employer and manager agree it is ok. Just saying we all trust people and at 22 if it looks good and older wiser people are saying it is ok then you could sign something you don't agree with. I also think it is unfair to say he is 22 he should know what he is signing, but really even so called simple contracts are hard to understand, you need a lawyer to decipher, and isn't your manager that person if you are a player?

[Triple B]

Sorry, but at 22 you've been an adult for 4 years.
You may be naive at times, but not stupid.
Regardless of what he says, he was in this at the time - off the record or not.
Can the AFL prove this though?

Well it appears you have the 'proof', perhaps you should offer your services to the AFL as a consultant...

[goswannies]

So, do you reckon that if Adelaide had cheated their way to a granny win, Trippet would have stayed at Adelaide?

LoL NO! Seriously, he got paid a truck load of $ to stay in a place that few people would actually want to live in (unless you were born there and knew no better) ... a premiership would have been a happy parting bonus ... a premiership wearing red & white next year would be the reward for enduring his time too far west of the Eastern State borders IMO

[MightyBloods]

Doesn't the player/manager lodge 3rd party deals with the AFL, not the club? If so he would know about it, if not lodged he would know about it aswell.

Woodie, I think its done by the club. The documents lodged with the AFL from each club are the player's contract terms and conditions (and all contracts should include any 3rd party payments/agreements as they are included in the club's total player payments). The manager and player gets a copy of it from the club. That's my understanding of it from a distance anyway so I'm no expert by any means.

If it's true that the original contract/letter from the Crows to Tippet and his manager included a statement along the lines of 'don't send/communicate this to the AFL'........then Tippet will need to defend himself why this wouldn't have raised some suspicion on his part and a probable explanation from his manager. His manager will need to explain himself as well to the AFLPA who help regulate Player Managers.

[MightyBloods]

Americans are great at doing Sports Documentaries. Check out the ESPN series (ESPN Docos) if ever you get a chance. I've always thought that there would be some great stories in Australian Sports that could be made into Docos.......and certainly the Crows/Tippet story is one. It would be very interesting to hear the key players speak more candidly(post their careers....Crow's officials, Legal Teams, Tippet, Tippet's manager, AFL officials, Swan's officials, Tippet's family/friends).